We’ve got another acting podcast today! Actor Matt Jones joins us on the Box Angeles podcast episode 346. Matt stops by the bungalow and discusses not willing to pay for self tapes, the state of television, never being happier personally, and more!
“We do so much work for nothing. Like I bought all this s–t, and I’m doing as much as I can.”
— Matt Jones
Beats
00:00 – Matt slates his name.
00:22 – Introduction.
01:20 – Sneaking things into slates.
04:38 – Not wanting to pay for self tapes.
06:33 – Matt is a fan of the podcast clips.
11:25 – Matt’s voice work and AI.
14:15 – Apple shows and the state of TV.
17:12 – Still having to audition.
21:58 – Gersh Agency and not needing validation.
24:38 – Coaching baseball.
27:01 – Walking away from the business.
28:55 – Never being happier personally.
30:35 – TV money not being what it was.
33:33 – Bob Hearts Abishola talent cost-reduction move.
38:45 – Should new actors be optimistic.
47:16 – Did Gersh try to sell Matt.
48:40 – Commercials.
51:03 – The math for cost of living in LA.
56:22 – Matt’s soapbox.
59:24 – Who took a chance on Matt.
1:01:08 – Matt Jones XLVIII.
More Matt
– Check Matt’s IMDb.
– Follow Matt on Instagram @mattjonesisdead.
– Listen to Matt’s first episode of Box Angeles, #092.
Transcript
MATT JONES (00:00)
Matt Jones. SAG-AFTRA. 6′ 4″.
I live in LA and I am willing to really do anything to my hair.
MIKE ELDER (00:25)
Hello, welcome to the podcast. I am your host, Mike Elder. Thank you so much for being here. We’ve got a really fun episode, a really great episode, a really optimistic episode. The great Matt Jones, actor comedian, returns the podcast. He did the podcast about 10 years ago live at IO West. You would know Matt from shows like Breaking Bad, the Office, Bob Hearts Abishola, Mom.
He’s got a ton of Credits. Click his IMDb in the description. But all that to say, this was a really fun conversation. I ran into Matt a couple weeks ago at a bar. We talked. We said, let’s get you back on.
And we did that. He didn’t disappoint. He talked honestly and candidly. And you’re going to hear a lot more of that in a matter of seconds. So without any more ado, ladies and gentlemen, Matt Jones. Is that how you normally slate?
MATT JONES (01:23)
No, no, no. I was just trying to think of dumb things I’ve had to say in slates.
MIKE ELDER (01:28)
Oh, yeah, do hands. Dude, I had a crazy slate the other day.
You should have. I posted it to my Instagram. I got so many mad responses. It was like a paragraph of what to do.
MATT JONES (01:36)
Oh, it’s like 12 things. Yeah, I was furious.
MIKE ELDER (01:40)
I had to memorize the slate.
MATT JONES (01:42)
I’ve started sneaking in things. I mean, granted, I don’t. I’m not booking things lately, so it’s probably not working for me. But there’s been a couple times where I’ll be like, you know, Matt Jones, I live In Los Angeles, 6 foot 4, you know, sag. And then at the end I go, really? Yeah. Or I do something where I’m like, just watch it. I just.
There’s no way of knowing if you’re watching it. I don’t know if you’re watching it. So if I get negative feedback, like, hey, don’t flip people off at the end of your slate, then I’ll be like, well, at least know my agents watching.
MIKE ELDER (02:18)
Dude, this is.
MATT JONES (02:19)
No one said anything yet. So they either– four or five. So at least either they find it funny or no one’s watching, but I’m not getting negative feedback.
MIKE ELDER (02:32)
Dude, I freaking love that. Because so many of my conversations lately are like, how do we stand out in self tapes? And like, I talked to Adam Shapiro last week and he was like, on the end of every site, I say I’m in New Zealand, but I’ll be back in a Day just to make it sound like oh what’s he doing in New Zealand?
MATT JONES (02:48)
That’s really, that’s really funny.
MIKE ELDER (02:50)
But it’s like we send these off into the ether and then we don’t know what happens to them. So it’s funny like that you’re shoot in Canada.
MATT JONES (02:58)
I’ll be like and also I’m married to a Canadian.
MIKE ELDER (03:00)
Oh nice.
MATT JONES (03:01)
For now. And then she laughs off camera and then I leave that in cuz I’m married to a professional actor. So she, we do, I do double the tapes and everything.
MIKE ELDER (03:13)
Oh you help with her on everything?
MATT JONES (03:15)
I do hers, she does mine.
MIKE ELDER (03:17)
Yeah, yeah.
MATT JONES (03:17)
It’s not always the most healthy things a little dicey. No, it’s just exhausting, you know.
MIKE ELDER (03:25)
Well feedback’s tricky right? You want to give them feedback but you don’t want to. I do self tapes with friends and it’s like should I give them feedback or should I wait for them to ask for feedback?
MATT JONES (03:34)
It just, it really depends because sometimes you’re just. Yeah. Especially lately where you’re frustrated and you’re like I don’t know if I’m doing this right. And she doesn’t know if I’m doing it right because no one tells us what to do. So there’s no like direction or a casting director so it’s really just I guess I’ll try this. And then I. And then sometimes I’m like really not right for the role but I really need to book a job so I’ll still tape because what if I am right for it But I don’t know like stuff like that.
And so I’m just frustrated and she’s frustrated and we have two kids and it’s late at night because we have to do it after the kids go to bed and we’re just bleary eyed exhausted and it’s hard. Having kids and doing self tapes is extremely hard. And then sometimes agents will be like well why don’t you go to a self tape studio? And we’re like because I’m not paying someone money. I’m not doing that. I draw the line. I’m not paying money to audition.
That’s what that is is paying money to audition. I’m not going to do it, sorry. Maybe that means I don’t get the next Michael Bay movie or I don’t know who’s, who’s, who makes movies now.
Oh, Christopher Nolan. Great. If I just mumble into the mic I’ll get hired.
MIKE ELDER (05:10)
I hate that too. The lack of direction. So there is no direction. I hate to go against what you just said, but I often hire coaches, especially for, like, big, hey, you know what? Because then they at least tell me what to do, and I can.
MATT JONES (05:21)
Like, honestly, I’m not saying I don’t understand why people do it. I just find it. And I’m not judging people that do do it, because there’s a. Especially people trying to figure stuff out a little more. I just find it morally reprehensible that it feels like we’re forced to do it. And I’m like, I don’t want to do it.
MIKE ELDER (05:49)
I agree with you. And I draw the line out when they say, use your environment. Go out and film it. And I’ve talked to a lot of.
MATT JONES (05:55)
I’ve never seen that. I’ve never had an audition where I’ve got. That’s crazy.
MIKE ELDER (06:01)
It’s so infuriating. That’s a coincidence. I have a square with a backdrop. You can have that. I’m not going out in my car and shooting a cinematic movie for you.
MATT JONES (06:09)
That’s a commercial thing, right?
MIKE ELDER (06:11)
More so.
MATT JONES (06:11)
Yeah. Yeah. That’s nuts.
But they do it because people do it.
MIKE ELDER (06:17)
I know. Which is frustrating. We enabled them.
MATT JONES (06:20)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (06:21)
If you give a mouse a cookie, he’ll want milk to go with it.
MATT JONES (06:23)
Yeah. It’s a great book for kids, by the way. Oh, we’ve read them all.
Mouse, a cookie, Moussa, Muffin, Moose, and muffin.
MIKE ELDER (06:30)
Yeah. Matt, by the way, before we get too dark, it’s good to see you.
MATT JONES (06:35)
Good to see you.
MIKE ELDER (06:36)
You know, the last time you did this podcast was almost 10 years ago. Hmm.
MATT JONES (06:40)
Makes me want to kill myself.
MIKE ELDER (06:41)
Okay, great. We got darker.
MATT JONES (06:43)
No, no, it’s just. It’s. I. Time is going by quickly and so slowly.
MIKE ELDER (06:49)
Time is a construct.
MATT JONES (06:50)
Don’t worry.
MIKE ELDER (06:51)
Nothing matters.
MATT JONES (06:51)
No, it doesn’t. It really doesn’t.
MIKE ELDER (06:55)
We ran into each other at the bar, and you were happy to see me, and you were just, like, super, like, talkative about the business, and I want to talk to you about the business and where your mind is now with it, given what we just talked about briefly.
MATT JONES (07:10)
Can I credib. Honest?
MIKE ELDER (07:11)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (07:11)
Tell me with you. I really like your Instagram stuff and. And the. The podcast. Like, the clip stuff specifically, because sometimes it’s so sad and I can’t think of a better word, like, it makes me feel, as an actor, pathetic. You know what I mean?
MIKE ELDER (07:37)
And liking my podcast. Wow.
MATT JONES (07:38)
No, no, no, no. Not liking the podcast. Some of the things were. You got there.
You’re talking about. It’s like, to a certain base level, it is so pathetic. And it’s okay to say that it is. You know what I mean? Like, it’s like, to act like it’s not is almost hard.
MIKE ELDER (07:55)
Could you give us an example? What do you mean, pathetic?
In what way? Like that we even have to talk about it, you mean?
MATT JONES (08:02)
No, no, no, no, no. In the way of, like, we. We do so much work for nothing.
MIKE ELDER (08:11)
Oh, my God. I feel seen.
MATT JONES (08:13)
Like, so we’re like, I bought all this shit, and I’m doing as much as I can. And even back in the day, you’d go into a room. I’m so old that I used to audition in person with black and white headshots, and you better bring a headshot those days. Go into a room and you do your audition, and if you’re not a total psychopath, you walk out of that audition going, hey, that went well. Or that didn’t go great. You have one of those thoughts or. I feel nothing from that.
I have no idea what happened. Sure, that happens, too. But usually most of the time, you walk out and be like, well, I feel like I learned something, right? The energy of that room, the direction by that casting director, the. I don’t know, just the energy of sitting there and having something memorized and yada, yada, all that. You just felt like you learned something. And the more I auditioned, the better I got.
The more experience came of it, the more I knew how to play the game. So much of it.
And that’s all gone now. If you’re not in person, it’s just, I. It’s no different than, I don’t know, just recording yourself, talking to yourself on your phone and then just deleting it. You’re like, that’s all it is. So without, like, feedback, it’s tough and in. And I’m not even blaming casting directors or because I have friends that are casting directors. It is not easy for them.
MIKE ELDER (09:59)
So do I. Yeah.
MATT JONES (10:00)
And I’m not blaming producers either, because I got good friends that are producers and showrunners, and they. I’ve had friends. Like, I want to put you on my show, and I can’t right now because I have no control over my own show. That happens all the time. Like, it’s just the way things are at the moment. I don’t blame anybody. I blame myself for choosing this career. No, I. Just kidding.
I can’t do anything else.
MIKE ELDER (10:31)
So all that to say you love my podcast, which was, yes, I was buried in there, but I really appreciate.
MATT JONES (10:36)
I Came in hot.
MIKE ELDER (10:38)
What’s funny though is like to your point was like, you love the clips and my podcast, the audio itself gets no listens. I honestly don’t know why I post the audio. Like, the clips get thousands and thousands and thousands, if not tens of thousands of views, but the audio gets nothing.
MATT JONES (10:52)
It is interesting that that is true. Now. I used to listen to so much long form podcasts and I stopped. I don’t have time.
MIKE ELDER (10:58)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (10:59)
Like I can’t sit around and listen to anything for more than an hour of. It’s hard.
MIKE ELDER (11:03)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (11:05)
But those like condense. And also when I see people now taking like editing and taking good bits of what came of that episode. That’s great.
MIKE ELDER (11:16)
Yeah. It’s much more usable, condensed. Yeah. And targeted to that person. Because the algorithm feeds you what you need.
MATT JONES (11:22)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (11:22)
You know what the clip. So I want to talk about your first interview for a second. Do you know what clips really took off from your first interview that we did live at iOS? People are obsessed with Breaking Bad, obviously, but also your voice. You talking about how your voice got stuck was huge.
MATT JONES (11:37)
Yeah. It’s just. Yeah. Do you want me to talk about it again?
MIKE ELDER (11:43)
No, I’m not.
MATT JONES (11:44)
Go look it up. My voice.
MIKE ELDER (11:45)
Do people still come up to you and ask you about your voice and recognize you solely from your voice?
MATT JONES (11:51)
Yeah, I get. I get trapped. All. A lot of times you’re like, oh, I thought it was you. And then you talked. I’m like, well, yeah, there’s no hiding. Yeah. I mean, I.
The only thing I’m really doing consistently right now still is voiceover.
MIKE ELDER (12:06)
Right.
MATT JONES (12:07)
That’s. That’s been my saving grace for years, has been cartoons and such like that.
MIKE ELDER (12:12)
Yeah. Yeah. Even back then you said that too.
MATT JONES (12:15)
I’ll say right now that world is the only world I’ve seen that hasn’t really falling apart.
MIKE ELDER (12:20)
Which is weird to me because when you said you were doing auditions with your wife still. I now, for the last couple months, use an AI tool that I just put in the lines, I upload the PDF, it takes all the lines, and then I say, this is me and this is you, and it’s an AI voice and I do all my auditions with an AI person now.
MATT JONES (12:39)
Wow. Really?
MIKE ELDER (12:40)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (12:41)
How does that work?
MIKE ELDER (12:42)
It’s great. The moment I’m done with my line, they say the next line. It’s so much easier than waiting for.
MATT JONES (12:47)
And you upload their voice?
MIKE ELDER (12:49)
No, no, I just. They have 50 voices to choose from. I just upload the lines.
MATT JONES (12:53)
No, I know, but like when you send your audition off, you can hear an AI voice.
MIKE ELDER (12:57)
Yeah, I do it on that computer and then I record it on my iPhone. Yeah.
MATT JONES (13:01)
Wow.
MIKE ELDER (13:02)
But that’s so. That’s what worries. That’s where I’m at.
Let’s get dark. I’m so worried.
MATT JONES (13:07)
Worried about. I.
MIKE ELDER (13:10)
Like when you see, like, there.
MATT JONES (13:11)
Are certain things, like comedy wise, there’s this Instagram thing called Fat Fellas. Okay. I can’t say the words because it’s just look up Fat Fellas on Instagram. And it’s very large black men doing very, very funny things.
MIKE ELDER (13:29)
Okay.
MATT JONES (13:29)
And it’s AI and it’s so funny. I can’t. I don’t know anybody who could make those videos outside of AI. It’s so funny. I can’t argue with the fact that that’s really, really funny.
MIKE ELDER (13:41)
Yeah, I’ve been really stressed out about this because have you seen those, like, short videos where a guy will set up like five mannequins, walk in and walk out, and then have AI make it into a complete lawyer scene? And it looks like a legit real scene where he just walked by lawyers and they were talking. It’s wild. Like, I feel like movie making screwed. And I’m excited to talk to you and confirm.
MATT JONES (14:05)
I mean, to an extent, yes, I understand. But honestly, do you watch a lot of TV right now?
MIKE ELDER (14:17)
No, I watch a lot of sports.
MATT JONES (14:19)
That’s everyone I talk to. I’m like, what are you watching? And they’re like, severance. They watched that. I really like the studio. I’ve got friends on that show. It’s a very funny show.
MIKE ELDER (14:32)
I’ve reached out to so many producers.
MATT JONES (14:33)
Incredible show. Besides that, I mean, every now and then I really like that new Jon Hamm show on Apple tv. It’s very good. Sure, Friends and Neighbors. But even then it’s like, man, it takes me and my wife weeks to sometime get through an episode just because we’re tired and we got other stuff going on.
MIKE ELDER (14:56)
But even everything you just. The three shows you just said, you even realize you did this. They’re all Apple plus shows where this is secondary and they don’t even care about this. This is just something to sell iPhones.
MATT JONES (15:06)
No, that’s not true. It’s not to sell iPhones. It’s to keep up the brand. And it’s because, honestly, Apple, like really likes celebrities and they like being famous and like going to these parties. Seriously. And if they have a whole movie studio, then they’re part of the conversation of what’s cool in Culture that’s worth more than spending a ton of money on marketing. It’s if their network is literally just marketing for the elitism of their products.
MIKE ELDER (15:41)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (15:41)
Which is not a bad marketing tool. And they’re giving a lot of money to creatives that they think they trust. And if those creatives get do a really good job with the show, then that’s great. And if they don’t, then they move on to somebody else like any other network. But at least they’re not driven by the desperation of needing people to watch their show.
MIKE ELDER (16:06)
Sure.
MATT JONES (16:07)
Because that desperation creates everything else we see on tv which can be written by AI. Yeah, a lot of it can.
MIKE ELDER (16:16)
So you think Apple, Amazon, them getting inscripted is good ultimately for the business?
MATT JONES (16:21)
I do.
MIKE ELDER (16:22)
Oh, that’s good to hear.
MATT JONES (16:22)
It’s not good for us monetarily. Yeah, definitely. But I believe that they, I don’t know, they look like they’re supporting creatives outside of like fx and I don’t know, there’s, there’s ideas there that are really interesting. You know, Netflix as well has good ideas, but then they’re still driven by a subscriber base, so they need clicks. I don’t know. I, I, I’m not smart enough to, I really am not, but I do, I, I, yeah, it’s interesting. The shows that I find that are very good right now are those Apple shows.
I just read a really good script this week for a pilot I’m an edition for.
MIKE ELDER (17:10)
Oh, nice.
MATT JONES (17:11)
That’s going to be on Netflix.
MIKE ELDER (17:12)
Wait, how much are you still auditioning? Like, to me. Why do you still audition?
MATT JONES (17:16)
Are you kidding?
MIKE ELDER (17:18)
You did it to me the last time we interviewed. You didn’t like, you give me like these to me from where I’m sitting, like, you’re, you have a, a resume that speaks for itself, right? You did how many episodes of Bob Loves?
MATT JONES (17:32)
Bob Hearts Abishola. What did we do, 80 episodes? Yeah, almost 100, right? Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (17:39)
You did 50 episodes of mom or whatever. Like, why do you still need to.
MATT JONES (17:43)
Audition four scenes a month? Because I won’t get jobs if I don’t audition. They, I have to audition to get a job. Okay.
MIKE ELDER (17:56)
You’re so matter of fact about it.
MATT JONES (17:58)
But I, it’s just the real I, I’m not gonna throw people under the bus, but I, I know people with Emmys that recent Emmys that still audition for guest stars. That’s where we’re at right now.
MIKE ELDER (18:17)
Why, like, has that changed? Like, were you.
MATT JONES (18:20)
Oh yeah. Oh, it’s changed since.
MIKE ELDER (18:22)
Were you offering offered roles previous? Like you had to be offered Bob Hearts. Right.
MATT JONES (18:26)
I did get that. But that’s just because I was on mom, right, Chuck? I was still. When I was offered Bob, it was because again, I was on mom previous, but I was auditioning for stuff all the time. Then I was offered anything. Yeah. I don’t know what else to say. No one.
There’s a thing I’ve heard lately where it’s like, oh, if you’re offer only, that means that you’re. You don’t get jobs. You know, I have agent and manager friends that are like, yeah, my offer only clients just don’t work because they don’t audition. Because everybody’s auditioning. Everybody.
MIKE ELDER (19:13)
How much? Okay, can I push back a little bit? How much of this do you think is a result of us doing what we said earlier? Right. Like we have left the straight up self tape backdrop and we are now being creative filming things. We’re like, there’s people among us going above and beyond that are doing things out of that and that causes this. And then maybe like, I don’t know, Jennifer Lawrence chooses to audition for something she really wants and it just.
Then the next person does it. The next person does it. Like, does it feel like we’re giving a mouse a cookie again, like with this?
Or do you feel.
MATT JONES (19:42)
No, it’s, it’s. There’s a significant amount of people that were on television shows and then that show ended.
MIKE ELDER (19:49)
Sure.
MATT JONES (19:50)
And they didn’t get a job after that. And then they needed money to live so then they had to audition. And that happened to thousands of people.
MIKE ELDER (20:01)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (20:02)
It’s not about like, oh, if you start on. I’ve heard that over the years. Oh, once you start auditioning then, then you always have and you’re like, that’s ridiculous. I, I need to work. I am a blue collar born kid. I’m like, I, I have to work, so I have to audition to work. I also have no problem auditioning.
If I, I went in for, in person for an audition and I was like, I was like, thank you, thank you, thank you. I could not stop saying thank you to the casting director just for seeing me in person because it made me feel like I was an actor again. I haven’t felt that in literally five years. It was my first in person audition in five years. That’s crazy. I, we didn’t start acting to yell into a microphone. Like it makes more sense to just make something AI and put it on YouTube if you want People to see it.
Because I make stuff all the time that no one ever sees. I don’t even know if my agents see them. Who knows? No one talks to me about like, I don’t know. But also, I’m not saying they should because they’ve got hundreds of clients because no one’s working right now. And they have to throw all the shit in the toilet at the wall and see what sticks or else their agency is going to close. Everyone. You hear about agencies and management companies going under all the time now.
It’s where we’re at. It’s where things are.
MIKE ELDER (21:55)
Okay. There’s so much to unpack there. First off, you’re with Gersh, right?
MATT JONES (21:59)
Yes.
MIKE ELDER (22:00)
Have you. Since when did. Were you. When did you join Gersh?
Because that’s a big agency. That’s one of the big five, I would say.
MATT JONES (22:07)
God, I don’t even know.
MIKE ELDER (22:09)
And when did they approach you? Was it when you got the Chuck Lorry show?
MATT JONES (22:13)
Geez, when did I join Gersh? I’m in curse like six, seven years.
MIKE ELDER (22:19)
Okay, six years. So to.
To your point, you said you don’t know if they watch it. Do you feel like you could ask them and talk to them?
MATT JONES (22:26)
No, no, no. I’m not trying to be a dick. Like I’m sure they, they do here and there, but also like, you know, the, the them sitting around and watching everybody’s audition doesn’t really change anything. You know what I mean? Like I. The turnaround, sometimes 48 hours. What are they going to call me and say to do it again?
They’re not going to do that to me, you know?
MIKE ELDER (22:50)
Right.
MATT JONES (22:51)
So I’m not, I’m. I’m of age where I’m not going to make a shitty audition. Like, that’s not where I’m at in my career. Yeah, they trust me. So it’s like they’re getting me the audition and all that, you know? Like, I don’t know what them even watching it would mean. Do you know what I mean?
What that matters.
MIKE ELDER (23:11)
Okay. Sadly, I feel like I’m your therapist right now.
MATT JONES (23:15)
I know.
MIKE ELDER (23:15)
You said, I don’t know if they’re watching it. And then you said, well, then you discounted you not getting watched. And you’re like, well, it doesn’t even.
MATT JONES (23:22)
Matter if they watch it does. I know those two things can be true at the same time.
MIKE ELDER (23:25)
You could still need that validation that they’re watching it. And even if you got.
MATT JONES (23:31)
Did you say need validation?
MIKE ELDER (23:32)
Well, you could use it. Even if. No, even if they said, you great tape, like something like that, would that help? No, really, it would help me. I like any feedback.
MATT JONES (23:45)
I won’t tell you what is. But I had a show recently that I auditioned for and I had a zoom audition with producers, which is awful because that is just not good for anybody. But it’s not their fault, not mine, and I didn’t get it. And my agent’s saying, oh, you were super close or they loved you all that does not mean anything to me. Yeah, I have two kids and a mortgage. I want. You got the job or you didn’t.
We’re looking for another one. That’s it.
MIKE ELDER (24:25)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (24:25)
The validation thing, I might have needed that in my 20s, even into my 30s, but I’m. I’m too old now.
I don’t know. I don’t know.
MIKE ELDER (24:37)
Yeah, that’s fair.
MATT JONES (24:38)
You know what? I coach baseball. I coach my son’s baseball team. And some kids need validation and some kids do not want it.
MIKE ELDER (24:47)
Right.
MATT JONES (24:48)
You know, it’s. However you coach, you coach every kid differently. And I am one that I don’t need a lot of validation. You know, I want conversations. I don’t want. Like, I want to talk, I want that. But I also don’t.
I don’t need you to tell me how you think I’m good.
MIKE ELDER (25:10)
So when. When you say earlier, there’s no feedback, there’s no direction. I don’t know if anyone’s watching. No, I know. You’re just talking matter of factly. That’s what it is. Yeah, you don’t necessarily want that stuff. You just. It’s just.
That’s where we’re at.
MATT JONES (25:25)
I will say, like, when you send in a tape and casting gets back to your agents, they’re like, hey, we really like his tape. That’s awesome. That’s great. You don’t get that much.
MIKE ELDER (25:37)
Never.
MATT JONES (25:39)
But that, that really, really helps actors. That one little moment of humanity, of, we really like his tape. Yeah, that. That’s all we have.
MIKE ELDER (25:51)
Now, I would agree. That’s literally all we have because otherwise you can catastrophize. I’m like, not even knowing if I did great. It’s like, did I do really bad? Did I? And then I just end up down these weird spiderwebs. If I did really bad, I did really good.
And I don’t know, because there’s no. It’s like a weird. Choose your own adventure.
I feel like.
MATT JONES (26:09)
Yeah, I don’t know. I’ve heard casting Erga seen 2, 000 people for a role And I.
And they say that. And they’re like, oh, isn’t that great? And I was like, no, it’s not great. You shouldn’t see 2, 000 people for the role.
MIKE ELDER (26:23)
No, it’s not.
MATT JONES (26:23)
You shouldn’t. Your. Your job as cast nerd, in my opinion, is to curate types over time. People with experience bring in new people and old people and a thing of both. And you should be seen close to 200, not 2,000. It’s crazy. Yeah, but I don’t know.
What do I know?
MIKE ELDER (26:48)
I feel like, wait, you can’t discount yourself every.
MATT JONES (26:51)
At the end of the. Discount myself?
MIKE ELDER (26:55)
You speak eloquently. And then at the end you’re like, what do I know? I’m just.
I’m just a clown. Funny guy. Have you thought about walking away to your point?
MATT JONES (27:04)
God, no.
MIKE ELDER (27:05)
Because I feel like last time you talked about this is the only thing you know how to do.
MATT JONES (27:08)
I’m in my 40s. It’s not the only thing I know how to do. It’s the only thing I. I’ve committed myself to for. You know, I have been in the union working solidly for over 20 years. I can’t. What else.
What else am I going to do? I like, I love woodworking, right?
I could go build furniture. So then I have to spend 2 to $300,000 on tools and a workshop and then start getting my business out there and working all the time.
You know what I mean? Build a business over five. Like, am I gonna do all that? That’s crazy. I’ve already built a business. The business of the tall guy with the weird voice that’s been working for 20 years. I just have to be there for the transition of my next self in this career, whatever that is.
Everybody likes to say I’ve written things in the past and made some stuff and stuff has worked out and has not. And you hear a lot now. You’re like, well, go write your own thing. Go.
MIKE ELDER (28:28)
I remember you were doing that 10 years ago. You were selling them scripts 10 years ago.
MATT JONES (28:31)
And they’re like, go write your own thing. You’re like, I. I have. And also, what if I don’t? I don’t have it right now. I don’t have the thing that I wrote. Like, I wrote something and then I was like, I don’t think it’s that good, so I gotta write something else.
But also, I have kids and I’m trying to get jobs. And you know what’s different than 10 years ago? I have a nine and a half year old. And I’m divorced and remarried from the last time I did this podcast. And then me and my new wife haven’t had another kid. So my second kid is with my second wife. And my ex wife and my current wife get along really well. They’re friends.
We are all like, my ex wife is still one of my best friends. Like, we are all working together. Like, personally, my life has never been better.
MIKE ELDER (29:35)
Oh, that’s good to hear.
MATT JONES (29:36)
I am so unbelievably happy in my personal life. It’s great. I love my kids. Like I said, I coach my son’s baseball team. It’s so fun. Last night we had a playoff game. We were there till game ended at like 10 o’ clock. We won.
We’re playing again this Friday. Such a huge game. We won 16 of four. We bit the shit out of those kids. Awesome. It’s just such a. It’s so fun, my personal life.
It really is. So if I had an opportunity to get a show where I have to move to New York for five months and I didn’t get it, I’m not that bummed. Yeah, I need the money. I’m not being very responsible with money, dude, but. But that validation thing, it’s gone. Because I love my family more than validation.
MIKE ELDER (30:35)
Can I ask you something very personal?
MATT JONES (30:37)
Mm.
MIKE ELDER (30:38)
Do you really need the money, though? Like, yeah. Really?
MATT JONES (30:41)
Oh, yeah.
MIKE ELDER (30:43)
Okay. When you see these, like, sitcoms that.
MATT JONES (30:46)
Go for five years, particularly done, dude.
MIKE ELDER (30:50)
Really?
MATT JONES (30:50)
That money is done. I was just on a show on. Just on a show that did almost 100 episodes on CBS. I did not make very much money from that. Really? No. We like residuals almost.
I mean, laughably nothing on network television.
MIKE ELDER (31:15)
See, this is worrisome. That’s scary to me.
MATT JONES (31:19)
Because you think there is no goal. That’s my point. Listen to what I’m saying.
I love my family. The validation is gone. I know. And your goal is wrong, man.
MIKE ELDER (31:31)
You come here to just stumble. My dreams. Second time.
MATT JONES (31:35)
No, no, your dreams are wr, right, though.
MIKE ELDER (31:39)
Wait, can you tell me?
MATT JONES (31:41)
I’m serious.
MIKE ELDER (31:41)
Wait, can you tell me what?
MATT JONES (31:42)
You made an episode or no. Okay, but I can tell you. I think I talked about this last time.
Actor math, right?
MIKE ELDER (31:53)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (31:54)
So if you HEAR Someone’s making 50 grand an episode, say that they’re really making 15 grand an episode.
MIKE ELDER (32:00)
Sure.
MATT JONES (32:01)
After taxes, lawyer, agent, manager, all of that, you’re really taking home maybe 15 to 20 grand.
MIKE ELDER (32:07)
Yep.
MATT JONES (32:08)
So 20 grand, you do 10 episodes, you’re only making 200 grand for that year. They held you for if you’re just making 10 episodes in a year, which most shows are now 10 to 13, making 20 grand. So these show. I know people that are series regulars on television shows that live in one bedroom apartments in the Valley. Yeah, like this. Like we are rich from television. It’s over.
I bought a house, I got divorced and then I. That was not cheap. And then. And then I bought a house that was falling apart and we fixed it up. So my mortgage is low, which is nice, but we fixed it up and we spent a lot of money on that. And then family and taking care of the kids and living in la. Living anywhere in America right now.
Like Mike, this cup of coffee, delicious. $6. Come on.
MIKE ELDER (33:02)
Where’d you get it? Did you go to Maru?
MATT JONES (33:04)
No, it’s called Collage. It’s in Highland Park.
MIKE ELDER (33:06)
Oh.
MATT JONES (33:08)
But you know what I mean, like, yeah, I do that money thing. You hear these stories. That is over.
MIKE ELDER (33:16)
Which is a bummer because I think of, you know, like Josh Radner from How I Met yout Mother. He does not do anything anymore.
MATT JONES (33:21)
Okay, so they made more money, right?
MIKE ELDER (33:23)
Because it was. Yeah, that’s what I’m saying. That’s what I’m saying. And to me that’s the dream. Like, or was the dream, which is dead now. But you do eight episodes or eight seasons of a show and then never work again.
MATT JONES (33:33)
Did you hear what happened on Bob Hearts Abishola?
MIKE ELDER (33:35)
No, I didn’t.
MATT JONES (33:37)
Okay. This was news during the strike, but it wasn’t really wildly reported or talked about that much because we didn’t. I don’t know, we thought about all coming out and getting mad, but it’s like, what’s the point? So going into season five, they basically call all of us. And the show was Bob and Abbott Scholler, one and two on the show, number one and two on the show. Then the family under that. My mom was three on the show, I was four.
And then everyone else down the line, they for the final season of the show said if you guys want there to be a season five, this is a non negotiable. This is what’s happening. They fired everyone on the show. All the actors were let go. Their contracts were all were nullified. So 1 and 2 stayed on the show. Everyone else is let go and everyone else was brought back as guest stars.
MIKE ELDER (34:50)
Oh.
MATT JONES (34:52)
So we had just done 80 episodes and then or 80 plus and we’re like, oh, renegotiation. You get a raise, right? No, you get fired and you get brought back and Everybody, Instead of doing 26 or 22 or whatever, now you get five episodes for the last season.
Oh, I was lucky. And I got six. A couple. I think everybody else ended up getting six. Somewhere around there, we got six episodes. And they gave us that option right before the strike, and then we didn’t work. And then what are we going to say no?
Also, we love our crew, right? So if we all say no, then the crew loses their jobs. And we. Also. There was this misconception about our show that, like, there was a bunch of series regulars and that they had to do this because there’s too many series regulars. That’s insane. We all had a come to Jesus moment.
We all got texts, said, how much do you make? How much do you make?
And we are. We were the lowest paid cast in sitcom history going out of season four into season five. Like, no one was making very much money. They. They fired all these people who already were not making money and then brought us all back as guest stars. And we all did it because we loved our show and we all needed the money and. And we didn’t want the show to end.
And we did our six episodes and Warner Brothers, like, Warner Brothers was like, bye. And that was it.
MIKE ELDER (36:44)
So that was Warner Brothers decision. Obviously, it wasn’t.
MATT JONES (36:47)
I don’t know. I. I can’t even begin to decide whose decision that was. But we were a bellwether of, well, I’m walking the lines of the strike, and people are like, what the. All these actors coming up. And like, I’ve never. No one has ever heard of that.
Everyone’s agent called and they were like, this has never happened before. We. There is no precedent because we’ve never heard of them firing everyone on a show and bringing everyone back as guest stars to save money. I. I still don’t know why that decision was made. I don’t blame Chuck Lori or Chuck Lori Productions or any of them. I know for a fact they don’t want to do that.
MIKE ELDER (37:33)
I was just gonna ask, are you close with Chuck? Could you ask him what happened?
MATT JONES (37:37)
I’m not gonna ask Chuck what happened. He. Chuck wants to pay people.
MIKE ELDER (37:44)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (37:45)
You know what I mean? Like, they all want people to get paid. They all want everybody to make their money and make a good show. That is not the decision of them. You know, we. There’s. And also, I want to work more.
So I still love Warner Brothers. Just like an abused wife over here. No, he still loves me. But yeah, like, for me, I was. I mean, I was a series regular. For nine years on the Warner Brothers lot, and I still never got above the amount of money. I know people get paid on pilots.
You would not.
MIKE ELDER (38:28)
I thought you were gonna give us a number for a second.
MATT JONES (38:31)
The number is lower than you think, I’ll tell you that.
MIKE ELDER (38:34)
Okay, so it’s under 50,000 an episode.
MATT JONES (38:36)
I’m not gonna say what it is, but it’s yes.
MIKE ELDER (38:43)
So let me ask you this. And we don’t have to be positive at all in this. I know. Last time you gave me grief about. Like, you didn’t give me grief. You were like, I know you want this to be a positive show.
MATT JONES (38:55)
Well, I was in a different place than I was 10 years ago. I was in a bad marriage.
MIKE ELDER (39:03)
You did tell me that at the bar when I saw you a couple weeks ago that you were in a different place.
MATT JONES (39:07)
I’m in a very different place, personally. Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (39:09)
After all of what you just said, I am nowhere near where you are. I am stressed out about AI. I’m stressed about self tapes.
Should I be optimistic? Should I keep pursuing this?
MATT JONES (39:21)
Yes.
MIKE ELDER (39:22)
If you had any feedback or thoughts for somebody, like, in my position, what would your thoughts be? Because if you’re struggling so much and you’re 20 years ahead of me, you get what I’m getting at. Find something in there. Or not. I don’t care. But I’m curious what you’d think to that. And I just quit my day job last month, by the way.
MATT JONES (39:48)
Okay, cool.
MIKE ELDER (39:49)
I was making very good money, and I quit my job.
MATT JONES (39:53)
Why are they hiring?
MIKE ELDER (39:58)
Well, see, that’s what I was wondering about you. You. Like you just said, you don’t want to do anything else, so.
MATT JONES (40:03)
No, I. If someone was to say to me, what’s a good number? Someone was to say to me, you get $300,000 a year.
MIKE ELDER (40:13)
We’re doing this.
MATT JONES (40:14)
$300,000 a year.
MIKE ELDER (40:15)
Frank Coyote just did this.
MATT JONES (40:16)
I love it. You never act again. Yeah, 100%.
MIKE ELDER (40:19)
300,000 a year for to never act again.
MATT JONES (40:21)
Done.
MIKE ELDER (40:22)
Okay.
MATT JONES (40:23)
I can take care of my family. I’m fine. I’ll do other things.
Do you know what I do? I play music. I play music all the time. That’s the thing that makes me happy. Yeah, I was just reading this book and they were talking about, like, personal life versus professional life and having a hobby that you don’t need to get anything from. I had this really great experience recently where friend was running the show at the Elysian, and I went and did it, and I. I played.
I’ve been writing music in secret kind of for over 10 years. And I played these two songs that I had written, and the audience, like, responded really well. And I was like, oh, yeah, I love music and I’m never going to make money from music, and I’m not going to be a famous musician. Like, I. Who cares? Like, I really like doing that.
Yeah, that’s nice. So I do that. You know what I mean?
MIKE ELDER (41:17)
For sure. Like, back to my question, though, here. Let’s get some optimism. Or not.
MATT JONES (41:22)
No, but should I. This is all a part of a greater point. Oh, I had done.
Sadly, I had. I had done this signing right in Albuquerque, went to a con, signed pictures.
MIKE ELDER (41:40)
And For Breaking Bad.
MATT JONES (41:41)
Obviously not for Breaking Bad specifically. There were Breaking Bad people there, but I had my own table agent. And, you know, people want signatures for other things, too, whatever. And you’re there and you’re doing selfies and signing things for money, and it’s not the greatest feeling, but again, you need money to live. And I don’t fault anybody for doing that. And in the backstage of that, I’m sitting around at a table with other people who have. There’s some people who have been much more famous than I am or I’ve ever been.
And we’re all sitting around talking and like, yeah, the industry’s not great right now, but that’s not what we talked about, really. We’re talking about our families and, like, our personal life and the things that make us happy. And like. And if this shit isn’t making you happy, like, I think there is a place of drive and perspective and they have to meet someplace healthy.
Do you know what I’m saying?
MIKE ELDER (42:56)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (42:57)
This whole hustle culture. And, like, I get up at 6am and I work on my sh. It’s like, I know people. I know very, very famous people with Emmys and Oscars that are not happy and they have gone through multiple sad times in their lives. And then I know people who have not worked much and are very, very happy people.
MIKE ELDER (43:25)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (43:25)
And the. Your career does not equal happiness. You winning an Emmy or being on a successful show can tear your life apart, can destroy your life. And not having a job can really, for me, like, make your time with your kids and your family. Like, some of the best times I’ve ever had.
So that’s where I’m at.
MIKE ELDER (43:58)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (43:59)
Not working lately has been kind of great.
MIKE ELDER (44:01)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (44:02)
I do need money, though. So. But if. If.
MIKE ELDER (44:06)
If you hurt, if you did, like, if you went to one of those signings and like, somebody said, I live In Omaha. I’m going to move to LA and start acting. Would you encourage them to do that? Because I hear you. I definitely hear you. Like, I don’t tie my happiness to this industry. I’m well aware not to do that.
That would be silly to do. And I have my hobbies, like golf, that I do tie my happiness to. And the beauty of.
MATT JONES (44:36)
Don’t tie your happiness.
MIKE ELDER (44:36)
The beauty of that is one shot can make me really happy. And all I need is one other 20.
MATT JONES (44:44)
Yeah, I. God, I don’t know, because I have people all the time, you know, like, oh, I want to get into it.
What do I do? And I’m like, I have no idea how someone would get into it. Now I really don’t even know where you would start, but I would say, what is your thing? Right. Like, you want to. You want to be the next Brando, right?
Go do theater. Go do.
MIKE ELDER (45:12)
You said that. I thought Brandon. Soren Bridger, by the way, for Brandon Sorenberger.
MATT JONES (45:16)
Unbelievable. Because I call him Brando is a psychopathic writer. Reference. If I said that. That is a deep cut, guys. No one out there knows who we’re talking about. I think they do. Only Brandon.
No, I’m saying if you want to be a. Like, a serious great actor, then go do theater.
MIKE ELDER (45:39)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (45:40)
Like, my friend, she’s doing this new theater thing in Ojai where she’s directing. Like, John Barenthal is doing this play, and they’re, like, trying to revive some semblance of a theater scene in la, and that’s driven by people who just miss acting, really miss doing something good, because we don’t get to do that. I think that’s great. Like, that’s something that you should do. If you like comedy, then go do improv. It’s incredibly stupid and a waste of time. I’m just kidding.
But it’s fun, and you’ll have a community. And then stop doing improv. Stop doing it and start writing sketches and film your sketches and create your own world and your own group. And you can do that from any city in America. Like, the training out. I can send you to so many different improv schools across the Midwest. There’s good theaters everywhere now.
There really are. I know good improv theater in Tulsa, in Oklahoma City, in Phoenix, in Austin, in every city. Like, you don’t need to come to la. That being said, I am from la and I love it here. And everybody who talks about how hard it is and they should leave, I’m like, leave? Yeah, this is my city. Get out.
I love it here. It’s a tough city, but it’s my city.
MIKE ELDER (47:17)
When Gersh approached you, did they try to sell you?
MATT JONES (47:20)
No, Gertrude never approached me. My man manager who I was with for a very long time, his husband worked at Gersh and I was at Paradigm for a long time and I needed to make a change. And he was like, do you want to come to Gersh? I was like, yeah, it was, it was.
That was it. There’s no like headhunting I pictured.
Okay, I’ll tell you. I was at Paradigm for a long time and again, no problem with any of those guys. Just sometimes you need to make a change.
MIKE ELDER (47:55)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (47:55)
And I went to make a change and there was a certain somebody who at, at that time was at w me. It was like, oh, you know, trying to sell me, sell me, sell me. And then when I left Paradigm, I was like, oh, you know, I’ve mom has ended. I’m in between shows, I’m unemployed, I’m looking new, new stuff. And he’s like, oh, I don’t want you now.
MIKE ELDER (48:16)
What?
MATT JONES (48:16)
Yeah, see?
MIKE ELDER (48:18)
Oh God.
MATT JONES (48:19)
I was like, so anybody who’s trying to sell you, I don’t trust them. Yeah, I, I have relationships with people and those are built over long periods of time. I, I’ve been in this business for far too long. Dude, you’re not selling me any snake oil.
MIKE ELDER (48:39)
You. That’s great. You used to do a ton of commercials. Have you opened yourself back up to commercials and have you thought about doing that? Oh, you are open to commercials.
Where you at?
MATT JONES (48:51)
Well, Ross, it’s funny, I went in and he had asked specifically if I was just coming in to audition for like this spokesperson thing. I went in, first call, did it. It was in person.
MIKE ELDER (49:04)
200 South Liberia.
MATT JONES (49:05)
200 South. I hadn’t been in years.
Went in, did it. Got the callback. Went in, did the callback, didn’t get it. I know they casted somebody who is a no name guy and saw the commercials and they’re terrible.
MIKE ELDER (49:23)
Oh man.
MATT JONES (49:24)
They are. They’re terrible.
MIKE ELDER (49:25)
They are or he is.
MATT JONES (49:27)
He’s not bad. It’s just, it’s just not a very good. It’s not good.
There’s a whole campaign. So you’re burying it. I’m not going to say what product.
MIKE ELDER (49:33)
Are you actively auditioning for? Getting submitted?
MATT JONES (49:35)
No, no.
MIKE ELDER (49:36)
Why not? Why wouldn’t you do that?
MATT JONES (49:38)
I would, I would.
MIKE ELDER (49:39)
So successful at it for such a long time.
MATT JONES (49:41)
I would. But if I’m gonna go back to that I’d be like, I’ll do in person stuff.
MIKE ELDER (49:49)
Yeah, there’s a lot more now.
MATT JONES (49:51)
Yeah. Like I can’t make it full time. I like, I just don’t have the time to, to shoot self tapes for commercials all the time. It’s just the volume’s too high. Yeah, you know, I get it. And also the payoff, that’s a whole nother topic. But that the payoff in commercials is the juice is not worth the squeeze anymore.
It’s just, it’s just not.
MIKE ELDER (50:17)
But that sounds like it’s everywhere though.
MATT JONES (50:20)
Yep.
MIKE ELDER (50:21)
And yet you’re still squeezing.
MATT JONES (50:23)
Still squeezing. I don’t know. I also, you look at. It’s the disparity in our business right now is so wild because I know some celebrities and I know what they’ve gotten paid for commercials and it’ll break your mind.
MIKE ELDER (50:47)
I know. It’s truly like late stage capitalism is happening on a microcosm everywhere. And acting is not immune. Like, I was just gonna ask, literally gonna ask you how you feel about A Listers doing commercials?
MATT JONES (50:59)
Because it’s like, what else are they gonna do? They’re not gonna. Like, if you are, can I push back?
MIKE ELDER (51:04)
Like, if you’re an A lister, they don’t need to work again. A lot of them.
MATT JONES (51:07)
That’s not true, man.
MIKE ELDER (51:09)
But if you’ve made $20 million in your career, that’s 10 times as much as the normal person makes in their lifetime. You know what I mean though?
MATT JONES (51:18)
You don’t know. You don’t get it.
MIKE ELDER (51:19)
Okay, tell me.
MATT JONES (51:21)
Oh my God. Years ago I did a. What was I doing? Some show. What was was the Office. I was on the Office And Ed Begley Jr. Was on the same episode I was on.
And we’re sitting at lunch together. I was like, give me your best advice, Ed. You’ve been in this business 40 plus.
MIKE ELDER (51:42)
You asking for advice is interesting.
MATT JONES (51:44)
From Ed Bakely Jr. Hell yeah.
MIKE ELDER (51:45)
I like it.
MATT JONES (51:46)
And he goes, keep your nut low. Keep your nut low. The amount of money you need to spend a month to live, keep it low.
MIKE ELDER (51:55)
Yeah, I agree.
MATT JONES (51:56)
Great. I followed that to a certain extent.
Also, I didn’t. Well. Oh, you’re on a show. Great. I’m gonna get a three bedroom, two bath house. Doesn’t sound crazy, does it? In LA that could be 2 million.
So now it’s $2 million. $2 million.
What’s your mortgage a month? Do you know?
MIKE ELDER (52:20)
Got to be about 10, 11.
MATT JONES (52:21)
Yeah. Probably closer to 12,000amonth. 12,000amonth. Just your mortgage.
MIKE ELDER (52:27)
That’s like your actor math for an episode right around that.
MATT JONES (52:31)
Yeah, but that’s not including anything else. So 12,000amonth.
Times 12 times 12. That’s 144,000 a year.
That’s probably more. It’s probably like 15,000amonth.
MIKE ELDER (52:41)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (52:41)
Right. So you’re talking around 200,000 a year on just your mortgage. That’s not including so many other things. Right. So if you are this big actor that was getting paid. I don’t know. God. Let’s give me an example.
If you’ve only. Again, you say someone’s made 20 million in their career, you’re like, well, 20 million. 25% of 20 million is actually 5 million. They only made 5 million. And you can only live off of 5 million in LA for like, I don’t know, six, seven years, five years if you’re lucky.
MIKE ELDER (53:23)
Okay.
MATT JONES (53:24)
Really, you can live in a one bedroom, but you can’t have two kids and live in. Live in a nice house and send your kids to private school and have to. So I don’t think you understand if a woman is on a show. Yeah, right. Woman’s on a big show nowadays especially, let’s say she’s on a big Netflix show. Right. And they have a big red carpet premiere.
She needs to buy a dress. They’re not giving her money for that dress. She has to buy a dress. That can be about a thousand dollars. She needs to do hair and makeup. That’s $1,000. They’re not giving her money for that.
They used to. Not anymore. So just her going to her own premiere is $2,000. That’s just the tip of the iceberg.
MIKE ELDER (54:15)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (54:16)
So you’re talking about just maintaining themselves in this business. Let’s say you’re Jennifer Gardner and you used to be buried to Ben Affleck and you’re still so famous and you have people trying to take your picture through bushes and you have to have security sometimes her overhead has to be insane. A year.
MIKE ELDER (54:36)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (54:37)
The amount of money she has to make a year just to live, just to break even is a million dollars at least. Just because didn’t keep the nut low.
MIKE ELDER (54:50)
I agree.
MATT JONES (54:51)
Because they used to make so much money that that was all churning. But now the money’s been removed from everybody. So no one’s making a million dollars a movie anymore. Like next to nobody. There’s a people that are making a lot of money per movie is like is a handful. Everyone else is making money on commercials. That’s how they can maintain that celebrity life is that commercial Money.
When’s last time George Clooney made a movie?
MIKE ELDER (55:19)
Last year he. They put it on him.
MATT JONES (55:22)
Right, right. One in the past five years. So he made his money. He made more on Casamigos than he has on all of his movies put together.
MIKE ELDER (55:31)
Yeah, probably. Casamigos is huge.
MATT JONES (55:33)
And then he’s doing Nespresso commercials. That’s probably paying an insane amount of money because it’s George Clooney.
MIKE ELDER (55:39)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (55:40)
They used to make movie. They made.
Loss of Translation is about a. The movie is about a celebrity who has to go to Japan to do commercials because it’s not respected. Now every single commercial has an Oscar winner in it. It’s wild.
MIKE ELDER (55:57)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (55:58)
So then what, what, what? Trickle down. Everybody else were like, I’m hoping. I’m like, oh, I Hope I break 200 grand this year. Which in LA, hello, is, you know, you’re lucky to have a house and a family. That’s where we’re at. So, yeah, celebrities need.
I would never fault a celebrity for doing a commercial. I will say this, though.
MIKE ELDER (56:24)
Oh, what do we got? What do we got?
MATT JONES (56:26)
This is my soapbox.
MIKE ELDER (56:28)
When they do crypto commercials, I shouldn’t say this. Oh, say it.
MATT JONES (56:36)
Are we a union or not? Right. We all walked in the Screen Actors Guild marches and we all suffered through the strike. Right. Then we come out of it and Hollywood has not gotten back and we have something like the Screen Actors Guild Awards. And this year for best drama, there is, I believe, six shows nominated, five of which were shot in England. One was shot in Canada.
I don’t believe those are union friendly shows.
MIKE ELDER (57:17)
Really?
MATT JONES (57:18)
No, I’m saying I don’t think that’s union friendly.
MIKE ELDER (57:21)
Right, right, right.
MATT JONES (57:22)
Because we also are partners with a. And all these unions, sometimes those are in. In Canada, you know, there are some agreements, but there’s a lot of reasons. There’s a lot of non union reasons to shoot in England. And I shot a show in England like you. They do not have unions like we do here.
MIKE ELDER (57:43)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (57:44)
So are we supporting unions by giving awards to shows that aren’t supporting unions?
MIKE ELDER (57:49)
Yeah.
MATT JONES (57:50)
And in that same regard, if a celebrity is getting $5 million to do a commercial and then they go to Buenos Aires and they shoot that commercial with a bunch of actors and a bunch of crew that are non union, where is all that money for that commercial going? That’s going into their pocket. So there’s a point where our union has to stand up and says, well, if you want to go to Buenos Aires and not pay union crews or union actors Then that actor has to pay a penalty. Or you as a production company need to pay a penalty to use that actor out of the country. And then that money goes back into helping people that are Ficor. And the money that the union needs.
MIKE ELDER (58:38)
Would you ever run for like a SAG board member?
MATT JONES (58:41)
No, I’m way too dumb for that. Dumb. You son of a.
I’m just saying I like no people. The only. The only power we have is the celebrities at the top. And the only time. And like, you even hear about Rob Lowe, him talking about, oh, yeah, he wanted to shoot a show in la. He said, I’m not doing it anywhere else in la. So they didn’t shoot the show.
Yeah, there’s also that risk. Absolutely. But then our union needs to step up and be like, so if you’re gonna shoot this show in Ireland, then there’s gotta be. There’s.
MIKE ELDER (59:21)
You should run.
MATT JONES (59:22)
I don’t know.
MIKE ELDER (59:23)
I went to the Stay in la. I actually worked it, volunteered at it. The Stay in LA rally.
That was great stuff.
MATT JONES (59:28)
Like more of that grassroots PJs doing great stuff. Yeah, I’ll vote for PJ, you know?
MIKE ELDER (59:33)
Yeah. My last question I’ve been asking, right, an hour, is who took a chance on you?
MATT JONES (59:38)
Who took a chance on me, huh? That’s a good question.
I mean, straight up. Laura Suhu.
MIKE ELDER (59:50)
Oh, yeah.
MATT JONES (59:51)
Laura Suhu was my very first ever agent of anything. She took a chance on me in 2001 and she was at Osbrink at the time, and her and I booked a lot of commercials together. Man, I owe Laura for getting me into the business. Absolutely. I haven’t talked to her in years, but. Hi, Laura.
You hear this?
MIKE ELDER (1:00:23)
That’s beautiful.
MATT JONES (1:00:24)
But I love that. I appreciate that. And then besides her, because as you know, the. The crossover from commercials to scripted is non existent. So then you have to have someone else taking a chance on you. And that person would be.
Geez, Brian Ferrantino. Yep.
MIKE ELDER (1:00:56)
Is he still an agent?
MATT JONES (1:00:57)
He’s a manager. Fiorentino or the Quest Entertainment now? Yeah, he was my manager for 17 years.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:05)
Oh, hell yeah. Amazing. The one thing I want to talk about quickly that I didn’t do. You know what number you are on IMDb? What number.
Matt Jones, you are.
MATT JONES (1:01:14)
Oh, like you’re like a 26.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:16)
No, you’re like 48. You’re Matt Jones, xvlv3. Isn’t that funny that there’s that many Matt Jones.
MATT JONES (1:01:23)
Well, I was Matt L. Jones for a very long time.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:25)
Oh, yeah, I remember that.
MATT JONES (1:01:27)
And I fought I wanted Matt Jones on IMDb, on sack. I want to just be Matt Jones on sag. And I got that a long time ago. I got. I was the only. I was the Matt Jones on SAG.
Somewhere around, like, 2007, I got that. And. And then on IMDb, it still was just Matt L. Jones. And I was like, I’m sick of this. I hate Matt L. Jones. I hate that. Oh. So then I was like, I changed it to just Matt Jones.
And by the time I did that, there was already 40 something. But I’m the first Matt Jones that comes up, so it don’t matter. It ain’t no thank you, Pope.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:03)
Matt Jones, the 48.
MATT JONES (1:02:04)
Fine by me.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:06)
Matt, this is a pleasure.
MATT JONES (1:02:08)
Yeah, sorry.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:08)
You always lighten my day, which I love.
MATT JONES (1:02:10)
Do I lighten it? Mike? Just need perspective, man.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:17)
I’m gonna quit this and go coach Little League baseball after this.
MATT JONES (1:02:22)
It’s the best.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:23)
All right. Thank you so much for doing this.
MATT JONES (1:02:25)
Thank you.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:25)
I really appreciate it. These will be great clips.
MATT JONES (1:02:27)
Oh, I mean, good luck clipping it down to me finding a point.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:36)
You have to tail slate at the end here.
MATT JONES (1:02:38)
Oh, tail slate. Matt Jones, 6′ 4″.SAG.
