We’ve got another acting podcast today! Actor – and commercial session director – Reece Rios (Scandal, Ray Donovan, Young Sheldon) joins us on the Box Angeles podcast episode 359. Reece stops by the bungalow and discusses the nuances of auditioning, the impact of self-tapes, the psychological demands of the entertainment industry, what he’s learned from teaching the Commercial Class, and more!
“I want to lower the stakes.
We bring in such high stakes.”
— Reece Rios
Beats
00:00 – Reece slates.
00:10 – Introduction.
02:35 – Time spent on video games.
09:03 – Session directing.
12:35 – How exhausting that job is.
17:46 – Giving actors the benefit of the doubt.
24:23 – Returning to in person auditions more lately.
27:26 – Thoughts on self tapes.
31:23 – Have self tapes impacted quality of in person auditions.
33:01 – What does session directing teach you as an actor.
40:09 – The need for a psychology of acting class.
43:33 – Journey to joining Groundlings Sunday Company.
48:06 – Why Reece books more dramatic work.
54:04 – Six different named roles in Scandal for the same character.
1:03:36 – Who took a chance on Reece.
More Reece
– Check Reece’s IMDb.
– Follow Reece on Instagram @reecerios.
Transcript
REECE RIOS (00:05)
I’m Reece Rios.
MIKE ELDER (00:09)
Hello and welcome to the Box Angeles podcast with me. I’m your host, Mike Elder.
We’re back, baby. Sorry it’s taking so long for a new episode. I’ve been emailing a lot of people and I’ve been shooting my shot. I’ve been going for some big names so they are less likely to come on or even reply to said emails. But I am trying to schedule more. I’m trying to be consistent. I apologize for the delay, but we’re back. So what did you miss me?
Little housekeeping. Subscribe to the YouTube channel. All the episodes are up there. Clips, important videos. That’s the best way to support me. I get paid from those videos. Everywhere else is just kind of pointless, to be honest. But if you want to, Instagram, TikTok, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, leave reviews, leave ratings, share with your friends and enemies. You know the drill.
Okay. We’re back with a great episode. This week I talked to actor and commercial session director, Reece Rios. Reece has been a commercial session director at 200 South La Brea for 16 years. I believe he said he’s been an actor for 25 or something like that. You’d recognize him from shows like Scandal, How To Get Away with Murder, The Rookie, NCIS: Los Angeles, Young Sheldon, Monsters, Speechless. He’s done a ton of stuff. He’s been on thousands of commercials, literally thousands. Count them all. He’s been around the block. He knows a lot about acting.
He knows a lot about auditioning commercially, which is what I was really excited to talk to him about. He gave a lot of advice and insight into the process and his approach to sessions with commercial casting sessions. And it was a really insightful conversation. I felt like Reece had a lot to share and a unique perspective doing both sides of it. Yeah, this was a good conversation. It’s good to talk about this stuff. It’s good to be back.
We talked about how actors need some sort of psychology and humanity class. Maybe I’ll teach it someday or maybe somebody else will. But yeah, there’s just a lot going on and a lot to process as an actor and getting to see so many actors come in for him to see that the other side. It’s just, yeah, we go through a lot and we need to lower the bar, as he said, lower the expectation bar, that is. Anyways, really fun conversation, really insightful conversation. What a return we are having here for you now.
I feel like I’m not talking good, so I’m gonna shut up. Without further ado, I give you Reece Rios.
🎵 ROCKFORD (02:30) 🎵
You wanna talk to me? You wanna talk.
MIKE ELDER (02:35)
Hi Reece.
REECE RIOS (02:36)
Hey man. Hi Mike.
MIKE ELDER (02:38)
Thanks for coming down.
REECE RIOS (02:39)
Thanks for having me. Yeah, why not?
MIKE ELDER (02:41)
I’m so excited. Why not? What else were you gonna do on a Monday on an unseasonably warm fall day?
REECE RIOS (02:47)
Yeah, right. I was watching my Call of Duty update. That was kind of the peak for you.
MIKE ELDER (02:53)
You’re a big gamer?
REECE RIOS (02:54)
Not a huge gamer, but I do kill time irresponsibly with some PS5 activity.
MIKE ELDER (03:01)
I don’t think that’s irresponsible. I think that exercises some demons, gets some dopamine, gets you in a little flow state.
REECE RIOS (03:06)
Yeah, fair. I guess, I mean, maybe irresponsibly by, oh my gosh, it fills a void, which is just time in which I have nothing to do. And so I think in that I feel pretty not terribly great about myself, but I guess it’s just not enough of a bad feeling to supplant the fact that I’m gonna go and get on with a bunch of 12-year-olds.
MIKE ELDER (03:30)
Well, I will tell you this, ’cause I wrestle with this too. I journal every day, and I try to avoid the way I should from my journal. ‘Cause I don’t, well, I do it on the computer. On my phone.
REECE RIOS (03:40)
Oh, you do it fair. Fair, okay, still.
MIKE ELDER (03:42)
And then I can use it as a reference and all that.
REECE RIOS (03:44)
Sure.
MIKE ELDER (03:44)
But I try to avoid the word should, and it sounds like to me you’re saying, I shouldn’t be playing Call of Duty, I should be XYZ. And I would encourage you, that’s just the world we’re in now with all this social media and content creation and industry where it is, where it’s telling us we should be doing a lot of stuff.
REECE RIOS (04:03)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (04:04)
Because we kind of have to, but also then we get dilutted and we’re not doing the stuff we’re necessarily good at all the time.
REECE RIOS (04:11)
Fair. I think being in this world, we’re always adjacent to people creating content and whether it’s by way of TikTok, which I’m not on or anything like that, or just some fun sketches. I don’t know. It does gnaw at me a little bit, but not enough to yank the controller out of my hand. I’ll just leave it at that. So I do. I like video games. They’re fun.
MIKE ELDER (04:34)
But what would you be doing? They are. And like I said, they’re a release. You get flow state, which I find very important in any, you know what I mean? Do you know what flow state is? The idea of flow?
REECE RIOS (04:42)
I do. I just don’t correlate that with With Call of Duty or. No.
MIKE ELDER (04:47)
Really? Well, I play Fortnite and I find that I get in flow, because flow, for those that don’t know, it’s the idea that it’s something you enjoy and it’s also a little challenging. If it was too easy, you’d get bored. If it was too hard, you’d quit. So you get in the state where you’re getting beat by 12-year-olds, but then sometimes you get them back and there’s a little bit of flow state to that. So I find in Fortnite, I get a little flow state and I find that’s good for activating my brain, getting me some, you know.
REECE RIOS (05:10)
Fair. Here’s where I think that makes sense because I’m actually pretty good at it.
My KD ratio is really good. And so I guess it’s not that challenging. It’s very repetitive and it’s something to, I don’t know. As much as I apologize to myself for spending so much time on it, and I’m also like, But I like it, so who cares?
MIKE ELDER (05:36)
Exactly.
REECE RIOS (05:36)
I don’t care. It doens’t matter.
MIKE ELDER (05:37)
That’s. See, you apologize to yourself, see, now I’m gonna go to therapy. It feels like a weird shame-guilt circle. Why? What’s the benefit of that?
REECE RIOS (05:49)
I think right now in this time and place, we are maybe tasked a little bit more to create, right? Because it’s hard out there and there’s not a lot of meat on that bone right now. And so if you have a creative background, then it almost feels criminal. Maybe not high stakes, but class A misdemeanor stuff to not be putting your energy. Look, a couple hours a day, That’s probably as much as I’ll give it. But then you turn it off and then you shift in the sofa and you’re like, okay, I’m just gonna take a nap. You know, it doesn’t dovetail into anything productive.
MIKE ELDER (06:29)
Sure. It’s like drinking, yeah. Once you start drinking, you’re not gonna start writing.
REECE RIOS (06:33)
You don’t get better with every subsequent cocktail.
MIKE ELDER (06:36)
Yeah, I can see that. That’s fair.
REECE RIOS (06:37)
Yeah, so right now it’s just a big him-haw. Through, interruption throughout the day.
MIKE ELDER (06:46)
That’s fair. I don’t want to like psychoanalyze you, but can you work it in as like a reward system? Like you do your two hours of creativity and then you earn 30 minutes of Call of duty.
REECE RIOS (06:55)
Oh you want me to earn it. But what am I gonna do before 8:00 a.m. that allows me to earn it? ‘Cause that’s peak gaming hours for me.
MIKE ELDER (07:00)
Go for a run? I don’t know.
REECE RIOS (07:01)
Oh, no. That’s, no. No, I usually do, I don’t play, it’s first thing in the, it’s like with my cup of coffee. I don’t know why it pairs well with coffee and just waking up, but I’m not gonna do anything between between waking up and gaming that’s gonna allow me to earn it. So I’m just gonna do it.
MIKE ELDER (07:18)
That’s wild. I’m a night gamer.
REECE RIOS (07:19)
Are you really? I used to be. I think most people are.
MIKE ELDER (07:20)
Like 8 o’clock. 7 o’clock before dinner, maybe.
REECE RIOS (07:24)
I think that feels like it makes more sense, but I don’t know. Something has shifted, man, and I’m definitely feeling that sort of 8:30 night night thing.
MIKE ELDER (07:32)
Well, maybe the competition’s easier in the morning ’cause all the good kids are at school.
REECE RIOS (07:38)
No, dude, those kids are vicious. And they’re not all kids. I think it’s nasty. I turn off all the chats. I don’t, I can’t. Deal with that.
MIKE ELDER (07:46)
Yeah. Yeah, it’s a lot.
REECE RIOS (07:47)
I don’t. I mean, I have people with whom I play online occasionally, but if it’s just me, I can’t.
MIKE ELDER (07:53)
Okay, wait, I got something for you.
REECE RIOS (07:55)
Okay.
MIKE ELDER (07:55)
To earn your Call of Duty for the day, how about this? Cuz they’re making a Call of Duty franchise, right?
REECE RIOS (07:59)
Say what?
MIKE ELDER (08:00)
Aren’t they making a movie franchise?
REECE RIOS (08:03)
Sure. I mean, I’m.
MIKE ELDER (08:04)
Why don’t you start reaching out to the producers and being like, hey, let me be a consultant. Let me be. Let me be Soldier number four. I’m a very good player.
REECE RIOS (08:14)
Mike. I know you know that there’s no fucking way that’s how this works. There’s no…
MIKE ELDER (08:19)
Well, yes and.
REECE RIOS (08:23)
Okay.
MIKE ELDER (08:24)
I know that’s not how it works, but I have the convenience of a podcast where if I want to be on something somebody’s working on, I can say, hey, come do my podcast.
REECE RIOS (08:31)
Oh, now I gotta set up a podcast, and I gotta harvest a following, and then…
MIKE ELDER (08:38)
I’m spitballing.
REECE RIOS (08:39)
I’d rather just be tapped on the shoulder and someone say, you. How about you be in this? I don’t.
MIKE ELDER (08:44)
But how are they gonna know if, well, I guess.
REECE RIOS (08:47)
I mean, look at these countesses, man. I don’t know. I don’t see that. I mean, it makes sense that they would make a franchise. I’m kind of surprised that they haven’t.
MIKE ELDER (08:53)
I heard that it was becoming a movie franchise, yeah.
REECE RIOS (08:55)
They did it with.
MIKE ELDER (08:56)
‘Cause all the. Game IPs taken off, Minecraft and all that.
REECE RIOS (08:59)
I mean, they did it with Halo, right?
MIKE ELDER (09:00)
Yeah, and Fallout is a huge franchise.
REECE RIOS (09:02)
Oh, that’s true. Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (09:03)
Anyways, Reece, I’m excited to talk to you because, do you know Jonathan Runyan?
REECE RIOS (09:08)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (09:08)
Great session director. You are a session director.
REECE RIOS (09:11)
This is true.
MIKE ELDER (09:12)
And I was talking to our mutual friend, Andrew Heder, and he’s like, you should get Reece Rios on.
REECE RIOS (09:16)
Oh, Andrew Heder.
MIKE ELDER (09:18)
He’s the GOAT session director. And I haven’t seen you in a while. Are you working much as a session director?
REECE RIOS (09:26)
Yeah, it’s been a minute. As a session director? Yes and no. Not as much as I used to. Part of that is, I said it earlier, there’s not as much meat on that bone, but also I’ve kind of pulled back a little bit. It’s a job which I’ve been very grateful, but it’s not, not exhausting. So I don’t, I mean, once Upon a time, I’ve been doing that for like, oh man, going on 16 years. And once upon a time, I would say yes to every gig and that would yield 20 days a month. And that’s a lot for that job.
I think the most I’ve worked this year is 12 or 13 days and that’s a lot for me now. So it’s usually around six to eight days. But again, a lot of it is just, there’s not a ton out there. There’s a lot of really great session directors that are just looking for some work right now. And the person for whom I worked most closely, it’s just every casting director across the board is experiencing less. Right.
MIKE ELDER (10:26)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (10:26)
And that trickles down to all of us. So yes, I do it, just not as much.
MIKE ELDER (10:30)
Wait, who are you mainly working for right now?
REECE RIOS (10:32)
So my primary is Spot Casting. Which is Jacob Klempner, a very good friend of mine, but I work a lot for Ross Lacy Casting, Alyson Horn, I worked for Alyson, Jodi Sonnenberg. I’ve worked for so many, but the dynamic is basically, about 15 years ago, Jacob asked if I would be his primary, and the way that works is anyone that comes and asks, because it’s an independent contractor status, right? We’re not employed by 200 South, I’m not employed directly to a casting director. But the way the system works is if I’m offered a job elsewhere outside of Spot Casting, my agreement, my gentleman agreement with him is that I go and say, hey, Jacob, so and so is seeing if I’m available for these days, I’m willing to work if you don’t have anything.
And that’s how that works. Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (11:23)
Yeah. It’s interesting that you say, does Spot come out of 200 South? Because I feel like I’ve been going in a lot more in the last few months. Have you seen it pick up in the last few months?
REECE RIOS (11:34)
Yeah, yeah, I have. Spots been out of 200 South, yes, since I’ve been there.
Has it picked up? Yes. And just when you think it’s picking up and it was like, yeah, pendulums swung back, it’s…
MIKE ELDER (11:45)
Goes quiet.
REECE RIOS (11:46)
It goes quiet again. And, you know, we’re at a time, what is it, November 10th? So that lobby should be jammed full of people in football jerseys and Santa Clauses.
MIKE ELDER (11:54)
Yes.
REECE RIOS (11:54)
And actually, once upon a time, you would see Santa Clauses in July. And all the football ads being made July through August, September. And it’s just been very peak and valley. So whereas I thought we were, there was about two, three week stretch. I was like, look at this, it’s like 2013 around here. It’s back to sort of, and also there’s, you know, at 200 South specifically, you see more random casting directors working there from time to time, you know, because those spaces are available to anyone. But yeah, it’s not consistent.
MIKE ELDER (12:35)
I don’t know what word you said. You said exhausting or maybe taxing?
REECE RIOS (12:38)
Exhausting. Both, it’s both.
MIKE ELDER (12:38)
That job is extremely that, is that outside of a regular job taxing or is there something specific that in it that wears on you?
REECE RIOS (12:48)
I think there’s something very specific and the way I would put that is I think you know, you’ve come in the room, right? I think that job.
MIKE ELDER (12:55)
Once or twice.
REECE RIOS (12:59)
Still got it. I think that job to do it well, look, man, you’re dealing with, and I’m an actor myself for over 25 years, that’s supposed to be a very safe space. We’re supposed to create a space that lets you come in and feel loose and absorbent, and I can come in and play. And on the other side, when I come into audition, I always appreciate a little bit of brightness, you know? So therefore, when I’m directing a session, I think that job requires personality. I think to be of service to actors coming in, you have to showcase a little personality and a little energy. I think it’s helpful.
It loosens things up. It breaks that sort of tension. And I will sum it up with this, personality is fucking exhausting. Personality is really exhausting because, that is who I am in the room, but it’s a little hyped up for your benefit. And now sustaining that over an eight hour period is really exhausting because I don’t think it’s fair to to be a little dead by the end of the day when all the 10 and 11am people got the best version of me. So sustaining that sort of energy, that’s really exhausting personality of on that sort of plane. Over a long day really wipes me out.
MIKE ELDER (14:23)
That’s really fascinating. That’s something I would never think about. But it’s true, like when I go in there, although I will say this, maybe I’m special. I try to give something to them, something different in the sense of like, I crack a joke after the explanation or whatever as I’m leaving the room to give them something, because they give so many of those explanations and people are just like not paying attention for whatever self-sabotaging reason, which is a whole different rabbit hole. And then they leave and then they have to explain it again. And I always just try to give them some sort of human interaction to acknowledge them as a human.
REECE RIOS (14:57)
I think that’s nice. And I think that’s great. And I think you hit on something that’s really frustrating is, you know, I think the hardest part of that is it is a it is basically an assembly line, you see, I mean, like, if I’m seeing whether I’m seeing the same role or different roles over the course of the day, I’m still giving the same explanation and trying to infuse it with the same energy and the same trying to be succinct and informative all at the same time. And then to do that, and then to be met with this blank stare of like, wait, what do I do again? I’m like, God damn it. That’s just so draining.
So when, you know, that’s probably the thing I appreciate the most is when I, it’s one of the things you’ll hear me say when I see work that’s done well, especially after our first take, I’ll say something to the effect of, oh, thank you for listening. And I mean it. Thank you for listening because now we can split some fine hairs and adjust some things, get into the micro bits of this and have a little fun versus me having to fix things that you just did not do because you weren’t listening or you got distracted or whatever. So however you register that at the end of an explanation, if it’s a little eye contact and you have something fun to say just to punch it up, great. Thanks for being there and thanks for listening.
MIKE ELDER (16:14)
I just had an in-person last week. It’s interesting you say that, ’cause I just had an in-person last week that after my first take, he was like, this is the first time all day I’ve said this. Or I didn’t have to say tone it down or something along those lines. And it seemed like that brought him genuine joy that he didn’t have to re-explain. And then he’s like, okay, now let’s play. And that’s so funny. I bet that’s really rewarding for you guys to finally find that.
REECE RIOS (16:39)
You know what? It should be the other way where for every 10 people, it shouldn’t be one or two people who are like, oh, thank you. For making my life a little easier. It should be the majority. But I think that’s the biggest thing that the biggest challenge is listening, whether it’s to me giving the explanation and being, when I’m being hyper specific about what we’re looking for, what I’m trying to get out of you, or being in the scene and not being, you know, watching an actor waiting for cues versus actively listening, you know, that’s what I typically see. I don’t know.
I think those are low percentage choices, but it does wear on us and it makes the days longer and harder. And so, yes, when you come in and you do something that makes me go, oh, thank you. I’m going to say something to let you know, appreciate you pal.
MIKE ELDER (17:26)
Yeah. Well, it’s just acknowledging the humanity of it, right? I’m sure a lot of people, it’s the same as waitresses and waiters. People go in there, order their food, rather than saying, hello, how are you? It’s simple humanity. And it’s the same with you guys. It’s a very similar setup where we’re here to do a thing or get a thing.
REECE RIOS (17:43)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (17:43)
And we’re just pretending you’re not there.
REECE RIOS (17:46)
Well, I mean, you know, there’s a lot of, a lot of. Look, I also have to, I have to take into account that I know a lot of these actors are coming in the room very nervous. They want to do well. They want to do what’s asked of them. And when you’re nervous, then your mind, your mind gets a little clouded and you will make you’ll have little lapses in listening and you’ll miss something little. But that’s just a very natural reaction to, or a byproduct of being a little nervous and just taking that extra breath. So, you know, I grant everybody a little latitude in that area.
You know, sometimes there’s.
MIKE ELDER (18:27)
That sounds exhausting to me. More so my personality giving everyone latitude would be exhausting.
REECE RIOS (18:31)
Yes. It is, and I can’t help myself. I’m not trying, look, I’m not sitting here on your nice sofa saying, I’m a really nice guy. I just can’t fucking help it. I really, I have a lot of sympathy and empathy for what goes on in that room on the other side. And I think I can do a pretty good job of telling when someone’s just either having a little bit of a tough day, having a hard time with the material, they really mean well, and those that just absolutely came in half-assed and didn’t really listen are a little entitled. Taking things a little for granted, et cetera. I think I can separate those two.
And when I see the former, I tend to, you know, give a little bit extra if I can, you know, to try and help things along. Because I know that when they walk, I know how it feels to walk out of the room and hang your head and go like, and I don’t want to be part of it, you know, I don’t want to contribute to that. But listen, we all have our limits.
MIKE ELDER (19:27)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (19:28)
And I’ll hit it.
MIKE ELDER (19:29)
The personality thing is interesting because to me, it’s all improvisers that are doing this mostly, you know, and it’s, it’s, I wonder where else you can get that much personality from somebody on an eight-hour shift?
REECE RIOS (19:39)
Well, I think a lot of that personality is, I think I’m a big show-er and tell-er. I’ve said that weird, but you know what I mean. I like to show and tell when I’m giving an explanation.
MIKE ELDER (19:49)
You’re demonstrative.
REECE RIOS (19:50)
Yes, and I’m very gestural. And then also, I tend to go through it. I’ll take a step back. One of the parts of the job is in the morning, you get the treatment, you get the script, and you basically are gonna pitch to the director. I’ll look at Jacob, he’ll actually go, how do you want to do it? This. Actually, he’ll go step further and show me what you want to do.
Because if I can demonstrate what i’m going for and he, he buys into it, then he can go on with without concern. So i’ll show him and you’re like, that’s it. Great. That’s what I want. Awesome. So then I tend to do that for the actor because I think a lot of actors can then cut and paste, and it helps with the timing. And when I feed you the timing, i’m not line reading you per se.
I’m just, hey, do this or your version of this, and you’re good. You know, you’re, you’ll be close enough to a callback. And if you’re right for it, that you’ll get one. So, yeah, it’s in that repetition that’s just draining. And so here it’s performative. You’re performing many, many times the same thing over and over for the benefit of others. And I think maybe that creeps in there a little bit.
I was like, it’s not my opportunity. It’s your opportunity. So I just want a decent break and I want to get home on time, you know? It’s tough, it’s tough, man, because like, and I’ve probably been guilty of this, but a lot of actors want to make their problems your problems, right? You know, as far as like getting places on time or having trouble with this.
MIKE ELDER (21:15)
Oh, I couldn’t find parking.
REECE RIOS (21:17)
Yeah, I know.
MIKE ELDER (21:18)
What’s the deal with parking?
REECE RIOS (21:21)
When I get this, oh boy, I’m about to give a cheat code away here.
MIKE ELDER (21:24)
Ooh.
REECE RIOS (21:25)
I’ll tell you what, yeah, I’ll share this with you. Where do I look? Hey.
MIKE ELDER (21:30)
Either one. Go to this one.
REECE RIOS (21:31)
So here’s something you can do to help your cause. If you’re really late, first of all, you should call your agent and let them know.
MIKE ELDER (21:39)
Yeah that’s 101.
REECE RIOS (21:40)
And then there’s another step beyond that. If your agent ever says, oh, I’m sure it’s fine. That’s not good enough. Unless they cite a specific, oh, we have another actor going in in an hour.
So clearly you’ll be fine. If you hear anything other than that, if you hear a version of, I’m sure it’s fine, You have to get them to, will you please send a message by way of text, email, or call them and make sure it’s okay because I don’t want to drive across town to find out they’re not going to see me. Right? So let’s make sure we’re doing that and treating it as a profession. Now, let’s say you’re an hour late and let’s say, I hope you did that because the first thing I’m going to ask you is, did you call? Because one thing I’m doing on my end when I have a schedule and I see your name at 11:00 and it’s 12:15 and you haven’t shown up, I’m like, where is this person? And what’s your reason?
Because what if I’m changing categories and I have to tear down something and rebuild? So here’s a quick way to absolutely assure yourselves I will not see you in that moment. You’re signing in considerably late and I ask, hey man, did you call? And you look up as you’re signing in and go, traffic. I’m like, you just blew it. I was waiting really in Los Angeles. We’re gonna cite traffic.
We’re not gonna have thought ahead or prepared enough to know that maybe I should leave five, ten minutes earlier or maybe. And how bad was… Do you know what I mean? It’s the most half-assed or no-assed thing you can throw my way. And there’s still always this sort of as they’re citing an expectation that they’re gonna be seen. And that’s when I’m like, you missed it. I can’t indulge this.
I can’t reward this behavior. And I’m not trying to be, I’m flawed, more flawed than the next guy. But come on, it’s really hard out there. And there’s a lot of people that would kill to have that opportunity. There are a lot of actors that would have showed up an hour early because they haven’t been in a room in months, if not years. So come on, man. Now, if you come up and you’re signing in and you’ve got your hat in hand and you say something to the effect of, hey man, I know I’m late.
I’m so sorry. If you can’t see me, I totally get it. I’m gonna go, Hang on, let me figure it out.
MIKE ELDER (24:04)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (24:04)
I’m a sucker for that.
MIKE ELDER (24:05)
Right.
REECE RIOS (24:06)
But show some contrition. Show that, like, you don’t just show me that you don’t think you can show up when you want, how you want, and you’re still gonna get in the, you know what I mean?
MIKE ELDER (24:17)
Yeah, 1000%.
REECE RIOS (24:18)
Just show me a little something that you think this is worth.
MIKE ELDER (24:23)
To that point, I feel like Ryan Bernstein told me recently, the casting director, that like a third of people aren’t coming to auditions these days or something like that. Or declining it or whatever or whatever.
REECE RIOS (24:34)
Whoa.
MIKE ELDER (24:34)
Have you seen an uptick in people not showing up?
REECE RIOS (24:37)
No.
MIKE ELDER (24:41)
I could be misquoting him, but it was a lot.
REECE RIOS (24:42)
I’ll believe Ryan, he is a casting director, he runs a tight ship over there. And he’s got good people running his sessions.
MIKE ELDER (24:51)
Henry, right?
REECE RIOS (24:52)
Henry, yeah, for sure. He’s great.
MIKE ELDER (24:55)
Henry always tells me to modulate. Everyone tells me to modulate, but.
REECE RIOS (25:00)
Henry says a lot of things. I love Henry Dittman.
MIKE ELDER (25:02)
No, I struggle.
REECE RIOS (25:05)
I love you Henry Dittman. You’re so stupid. But look, if he’s saying a third, here’s what he might be citing, maybe like, because on the day that the schedule gets handed to me, by then, maybe he’s seen a third of people decline or cancel, and he’s gonna make an effort to fill those slots, right? So by the time I get there, I believe him. I can’t imagine, you know, look, this is my, that’s my primary job is, you know, that’s been my livelihood for 20 plus years, commercial acting. So I’m like, I get those opportunities that takes priority. So, you know, but I don’t know, it’s very weird out there today. And people are having to gig real hard just to get by.
And so who knows, maybe that means more fallout.
MIKE ELDER (25:50)
Interesting.
REECE RIOS (25:50)
There’s some logic there maybe. No, usually by the time I get the schedule, it’s pretty firm and confirmed.
MIKE ELDER (25:57)
Got it. Speaking of, I had a 5:55 p.m. audition this past Friday.
REECE RIOS (26:02)
Was it for what?
MIKE ELDER (26:02)
It felt like pre-pandemic again.
REECE RIOS (26:04)
5:55 in person. Who was it for?
MIKE ELDER (26:07)
Elevator.
REECE RIOS (26:07)
Oh, right on.
MIKE ELDER (26:08)
Yeah, I was like, this is great. Although it was dark after I was driving there. I was like, oh, this is depressing. But I was like, this is pre-pandemic style.
REECE RIOS (26:16)
Have you found that you’ve not had to how often do you get in the room?
MIKE ELDER (26:20)
Last week I was in the room three times. A callback and then two in person.
REECE RIOS (26:24)
Congrats.
MIKE ELDER (26:24)
First calls, yeah.
REECE RIOS (26:25)
But has that been an anomaly for the last couple of years?
MIKE ELDER (26:28)
No. I mean, the last six months, I feel like I’m going in a lot more.
REECE RIOS (26:31)
Okay.
MIKE ELDER (26:32)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (26:32)
Yeah, I feel like there has been a little bit of an uptick.
MIKE ELDER (26:35)
Particularly there.
REECE RIOS (26:36)
Yes.
MIKE ELDER (26:37)
Both Ryan and Ed at Elevator do a lot in person.
REECE RIOS (26:41)
Yeah, they do. They do. And so do the people at 200. I think there are, look, I think we’re in a hybrid world and I think that makes sense and I think it’s here to stay.
I get it. I get when the role is so simple, it’s a reaction or it’s a one line or something and it can be easily executed at home. Maybe you’re saving the client a little money or they’re working with a smaller budget. But I think for the most part, they can, they’re bringing people in the room, especially when they know that there’s some blocking involved and there’s multiple people having dialogue, etc. They try to anyway. That said, there are some casting directors that I think are still pretty firm for self tapes strictly and okay. You know, I don’t think that, I don’t think it’s going away.
MIKE ELDER (27:26)
I mean, I think I know this answer. Do you resent self tapes because it’s cutting into your work as well as the product that you get to offer as an actor?
REECE RIOS (27:33)
So, as an actor, I don’t like them. I don’t like them. I don’t, it hasn’t served me very well. Especially theatrically. I just, I don’t, I, I think, I, I think I probably had the same reaction as most when we realized self tapes were coming. I think it was probably this, this initial, oh, neat. I can stay home and then I can, I can relax into it.
I have, I can do infinite takes if necessary. And then what I’ve learned along the way is, first of all, infinite takes bad. I think there’s diminishing return and it happens quickly. I also think it’s a little bit of false advertising in some way. If it takes me 25 takes to get, I was like, that’s not going to fly, you know? Chasing some level of perfection, I just think it can really work against you. Then I realized I was like, oh, I think one of the things I liked about myself was taking the adjustment, getting the note directly and then applying the note and treating it more of a work session, a workshop.
A collaborative effort with someone giving me notes versus I think this is it. So for as an actor, I think I’m in the minority here, but I don’t like self tapes on and level.
MIKE ELDER (28:50)
No, I think you’re, I think everyone hates them.
REECE RIOS (28:52)
Really?
MIKE ELDER (28:52)
Yes.
REECE RIOS (28:53)
Really?
MIKE ELDER (28:53)
I just saw a new Instagram called We Hate Self Tapes and we’re a group of actors that wanna end self tapes.
REECE RIOS (29:00)
Oh. Maybe more people are coming to me because I also teach and I know I talk to my students a lot and seems like I think the overwhelming majority like the self tape.
MIKE ELDER (29:09)
Huh.
REECE RIOS (29:09)
But maybe, look, I mean, this podcast is illuminating.
MIKE ELDER (29:13)
This podcast is very against them, yeah.
REECE RIOS (29:14)
Is it? Okay, right on. But I also understand.
MIKE ELDER (29:18)
Well, I understand. Like, for somebody like me who can’t book anything and the amount of one-line opportunities for theatrical gigs I’ve gotten via self tapes, I realize I probably wouldn’t have got those if we were in the room. So I recognize the benefit to that, but I also, I think it’s too much of a detriment.
REECE RIOS (29:33)
I just don’t know. I think so, and I think there’s something, I think, you know, especially Theatrically speaking, those one-liners can be, they’re so, they’re so hard. Right? This is something that people have said before, one or two line auditions are more difficult than, you know, when you get three pages, because what do I do? And, but I think showcasing what you do in the flesh.
MIKE ELDER (29:54)
I agree.
REECE RIOS (29:55)
And with that come, you know, under duress and, and it’s, you know, all I know is I can either be at home by myself and come up with clever ways to deliver this one line, or I can be in the room, be a little bit nervous, but but demonstrate what I can bring to a live set that will have hundreds of onlookers. And I wonder how many times, you know, someone has booked something from the safe confine, the warm confine of their own home, only to find themselves on set with a bunch of strangers looking at them and going, oh, butt puckering.
MIKE ELDER (30:24)
We’ve had stories on the podcast. Yeah, we’ve had stories.
REECE RIOS (30:26)
Have you?
MIKE ELDER (30:28)
Yeah. Directors, it happens.
REECE RIOS (30:29)
Oh, I’m sure. I’ve always wondered, I imagined it happened. I’ve never heard, but I’m like, I just, because I coach a lot and I coach for theatrical and commercial and I, there are sometimes that I’ll coach someone and we’ll spend a long time on something. I’m like, okay, we got it. We got it.
MIKE ELDER (30:48)
It took forever, yeah.
REECE RIOS (30:49)
And then they book it. Oh. And I’m, I just, my visceral reaction is one of, I’m like, oh, I’m so thrilled. But immediately I’m like, okay, I hope.
MIKE ELDER (30:59)
It goes okay.
REECE RIOS (31:00)
Yeah, get in there and do your job.
MIKE ELDER (31:01)
There’s something about turning on.
REECE RIOS (31:03)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (31:03)
Before an improv show, you turn on. You know what I mean? A little nervous. You have to show up for that.
REECE RIOS (31:08)
Yeah. And I think all of that can be used for good.
MIKE ELDER (31:13)
Have you seen, I was gonna ask you this, this was on my list. Have you seen since self tapes has become the norm, like any issues in the room resulting from that? Are people, more cocksure coming in the room or something and more air prone or anything like that? Has it been a detriment to in-person auditions?
REECE RIOS (31:32)
Well, that’s an interesting question. You know, it’s nothing that I’ve been able to read. And I guess, I guess maybe not, because one thing I constantly get when I’m directing sessions is when the audition is done, a person that hasn’t been in the room for a long time will let you know, usually by way of, It’s good to be back in the room. Thank you so much. This felt great. You know, and it was like, oh, it’s just, and so I’m like, oh, okay, you haven’t been in the room in a while. You know, some people get in regularly, some people it’s been years.
Years, you know, and I don’t, I’m not, I try not to be tone deaf about that. I was like, that person that’s walking in right now, though maybe you and I have been a little bit more fortunate getting in the room in the last couple of years, there are still people that are coming in for the first time since the pandemic still, and they express gratitude pretty much every time. But there’s only, but there was only one time that an actor came in. And an actor of note that I know has worked, had a pretty decent career anyway, and they really, really struggled early on in that one audition. It’s like visibly shaking and sweating and things like that. And it was, I remember stopping down, swinging the camera around, walking down, sitting down with them for a couple minutes saying, hey, man, it’s all good. You know, it’s, you’re gonna be fine. It’s good.
You know, they had to find their footing again. And that was a very dramatic example of it. But beyond that, it’s been no, I can’t really read anything.
MIKE ELDER (32:59)
Interesting.
REECE RIOS (33:00)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (33:01)
That’s interesting. Have you, have you, you said you’ve been session directing for 16 years?
REECE RIOS (33:05)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (33:05)
Do you, have you found, does that make you a better actor, session directing?
REECE RIOS (33:11)
I do get that question a lot.
MIKE ELDER (33:13)
Oh lame, never mind, I take it back.
REECE RIOS (33:14)
No, no, no, no, no. It’s a wonderful question. That’s why. Because it’s, it’s, it’s probably the, the, the, the number one question people have about that job is like, you know, but they, it’ll be phrased a number of ways, you know, what have you learned? And my answer is always the same. I was like, I learned what not to do. Yeah. And what not to, and I don’t even mean what not to do as an actor, but what not to do as a person in the room.
I have, you know, I have one simple objective when I get in the room. I want to get in there, I want to speak when spoken to, I want to be the best listener in the room, and I want to get the fuck out of there as fast as I can.
Sorry, I cussed. Is that bad?
MIKE ELDER (33:53)
You’re fine.
REECE RIOS (33:53)
Is that okay? I should have asked first. I used to cuss. I cuss a lot, but I’m trying to be good on your program here. If that’s okay, forgive me if you’re like, Hey, dude, we have a very young audience. And kids don’t cuss. No one under the age of 25 cusses.
So it’s what not to do, what not to do. I don’t, I keep it really simple. I just want to be, listen, I want to do what is asked of me and I want to get the hell out of there. I don’t want to try and do anything extra. Nothing is universal from one director, one opportunity to the next, but I’ve seen so many that I’m like, okay, I know the majority of times, best thing to do is this, which is just be myself, breathe, do the job, get out.
MIKE ELDER (34:43)
Yeah, I sat in with your buddy Colin.
REECE RIOS (34:46)
Colin Sweeney.
MIKE ELDER (34:47)
Colin Sweeney.
REECE RIOS (34:48)
Colin Sweeney. Did you really?
MIKE ELDER (34:49)
Probably 12 years ago. In a session. Yeah, he was like, you, should sit in with me.
REECE RIOS (34:53)
No kidding.
MIKE ELDER (34:53)
Cause I interned at Westside.
REECE RIOS (34:54)
One of my closest friends. Oh yeah.
MIKE ELDER (34:57)
It was like, yeah, he was like, you just see it. When it works, it works, you see it. And it’s like, you learn, you just seeing other people do it and realizing everybody is going through the same ordeal. It just like very, it evens the playing field a little bit, I think.
REECE RIOS (35:14)
I think that’s a good way to put it.
MIKE ELDER (35:15)
Because we think people, it’s kind of like sex. We think people are like, well, maybe not sex.
REECE RIOS (35:19)
No, no, go on. I wanna hear.
MIKE ELDER (35:20)
Everyone does it behind closed doors. We think we know what we’re doing, but we never really were taught what to do. And then we’re kind of in there and we’re like, and then every everyone’s sort of like that, you know?
REECE RIOS (35:30)
That’s not at all like sex, I never know what I do. I don’t know what I’m doing.
MIKE ELDER (35:36)
Right, but like you assume other people know and then you see other people. It’s like voting.
REECE RIOS (35:39)
Oh no no no.
MIKE ELDER (35:41)
Everyone assumes you go to the voting booth and you know how to punch the thing and then you get hanging chads and then nobody actually knows because nobody’s been taught what to do.
REECE RIOS (35:51)
I mean, fair.
MIKE ELDER (35:52)
We all have our thoughts and insecurities and when we’re in there, it’s all manifest and we’re all, it’s just really interesting to watch.
REECE RIOS (36:00)
I think the misconception is that most people, and I’ve heard as much, people will say, oh, you see what the best people do. But what I infer from that statement is that, oh, and do you think that I try that? Because that’s insane. What the best people do, what are the best in this case meaning those that work consistently or the faces with which we’re familiar being on television all the time, great. If they do something and then I try to do that thing, that thing will fall so flat. And another way to put it is it’ll look so inauthentic. What I take from that is, cool, I’ll bring my own little isms and toys into the room, my own little wackadoo nuances, and that’s what I have to sell.
And I’ll be very comfortable selling that. And if they’re not buying it, there’s not much I can do. But to do that specific thing or to deliver, I think sometimes a lot of people come in with a result-oriented mindset. Meaning like, what’s the finished product you need to see? What’s the polish on this? What’s the button I need to get to the callback? And I’m like, oh, I don’t think that’s the way at all.
MIKE ELDER (37:11)
But wouldn’t it be great if there was a way?
REECE RIOS (37:13)
Wouldn’t it be great?
MIKE ELDER (37:15)
I’m a math mind, so I’m always looking for like patterns.
REECE RIOS (37:18)
Very analytical.
MIKE ELDER (37:19)
Analytical. I’m trying to figure out what the key is.
REECE RIOS (37:21)
Yeah. Crack that code man.
MIKE ELDER (37:22)
Like. If they make us wait after a call, last week one guy got asked to wait. I was like, that’s good, nobody else has been asked to wait. He’s like, no, everyone’s been waiting. I’m like, yeah, but you’re the one that got asked to wait. That’s a good sign. And then I get out and they’re like, you,’re good to go. And I’m like, son of a.
REECE RIOS (37:35)
I know. And we’ll take that personally. We’ll take that personally many times, right?
What did I do wrong?
MIKE ELDER (37:45)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (37:45)
But I think the thing that we gotta remind ourselves of, and I had a manager that told me this years ago, and I think this was, I still hang on to this because, yeah, we have to remind ourselves how hard it is out there. And I tell my students this all the time. And we cannot just measure success by bookings alone because we won’t last.
It’s way too hard. But that when we walk in a room, whom clients and or directors, even sometimes session directors think one of two things when they lay eyes on us for the first time, and that is, oh, please be good.
Or, next. Right? And if you’re next, not much you can do. And what does it mean to be next?
Well, I don’t know. It just means that when they close their eyes, you weren’t it. Whether it’s the shape of your head or the whatever, the color of your eyes or your tooth, whatever. It just does not hit that tuning fork in their belly that makes them interested.
MIKE ELDER (38:37)
Right, and that’s what I kind of learned from the call-in session was like, you just see the people that sort of fit. It’s hard, it doesn’t make sense. It’s not, you can’t explain it.
REECE RIOS (38:46)
But we still take it personally.
MIKE ELDER (38:48)
Yeah, right.
REECE RIOS (38:48)
We still take it. You weren’t asked to stay. What did I do wrong? What could I have done different? That’s the question I get a lot after callbacks. Could I have done anything different? To which I often say, nope. Now there are times that, yeah, you just were not listening and you didn’t do what was asked of you, so you were a please be good, but you But most of the time it’s like, buddy, there’s a lot of times I’m running a session and I see someone do, Mike, you come in and you do a great job.
And I’m sincerely happy with what you did. First of all, I have a hard time lying about that stuff, so I don’t say, Great job if I don’t mean it. I’ll say something else.
MIKE ELDER (39:27)
Nice to see you.
REECE RIOS (39:29)
By the way, now you’re getting my other tell. I shouldn’t have said that one because now I’m going to be looking now I got a tell. But I’ll say, Great job. Then I’ll see you two weeks later in the lobby or where at Erewhon not at Erewhon. I won’t go to Erewhon but I’ll see you somewhere and how are you doing?
Oh good man? I didn’t get a call back for that thing you’ll say and I’ll say oh yeah, and then you’ll say you said I did a great job, you know, and I’ll look at you and go you did.
You did a great job and it just wasn’t the thing. You can’t do a damn thing about that, can you. It’s tough.
MIKE ELDER (40:09)
While you were talking, I was like, I should teach a business of acting class, but now I’m thinking, sidebar, I don’t want to teach one, but I feel like there could be some money there. But what would honestly be better is like a psychological slash humanity of acting class where it’s like acknowledging the session directors and like realizing that you You probably didn’t do anything wrong. You did exactly what you should have done and it was through no fault. There’s just so much of that that I’ve learned and clearly you’ve learned but it’s taken us many years to learn. And I feel like it would behoove a lot of new actors.
REECE RIOS (40:44)
Yeah, I think there’s something to that. I teach and I spend a lot of time the first hour I’m talking to a new crop of students, I’m letting them know my objective here is simple. I want to lower the stakes. We bring in such high stakes. We bring in the highest stakes because especially at a callback and when we bring in those stakes, you’re so close. If I get this job, this job, this job, if I book this job, I’ll show Mom and Dad, friends from high school. See, this is a career and so much, we put so much on that and so much that, like, we abandon all of the things that, you know, now.
Now we’re coming in. We’re not breathing or breathing shallow, and then we’re not listening.
We’re clouded, and we. And it’s a blur. And we walk out and we’re like, oh, I hope I got it. And it’s like, oh, man, if I can effectively lower the stakes by teaching you the math of this business, like you said, the. The arithmetic, the. The realities, right? The truth.
Of how this, the arbitrary reasons people do and don’t get jobs. If you can, if you have that knowledge, then at the least, maybe you can go in the room and going, there’s only so much I can fucking do.
MIKE ELDER (41:57)
A thousand percent, yeah. For every one booking.
REECE RIOS (42:00)
This is it. My wrists don’t get thicker than this. So if you want me to be a fireman, this is as big as these hands get. I’m not your guy, that’s okay. I’m outing myself.
MIKE ELDER (42:11)
Wait, what class do you teach?
REECE RIOS (42:13)
I teach, it’s called the Commercial Class.
MIKE ELDER (42:15)
Oh, you teach the AHC Ross Lacy one.
REECE RIOS (42:17)
Yeah, I’ve been doing that for about eight years, and I teach an advanced class. I’ve also taught also, I’ve taught at Amda and I guess taught at like AFI and stuff like that.
MIKE ELDER (42:25)
Do you like teaching better than session drinking? Since you can give the truth to these?
REECE RIOS (42:32)
I am infused with a different energy when I teach and I teach at night and I think like there’s such a wide-eyed earnest nature to their being there wanting to learn and absorb that I do. There’s a difference between looking at their faces and someone coming in the room going, so what am I doing?
What am I doing? Someone that… That’s not fair because everyone that comes in comes in is different. But like, I think as a whole, this group of people in front of me, these 15 people or whatever, are really here to learn from me. So I’m going to give them, you know, my all. And it’s a three hour class that flies by. So I think I do like it a little bit more because it’s also not as repetitive and I keep it a very open forum.
So we’re always going down random avenues and I find that helpful for everybody. And so it’s energizing in a way. I go home very tired, but I ultimately do like it. And I do like directing sessions. I like helping people get work. I really do. It’s just exhausting. I’m tired.
I’m old and tired. You see Mike, I’m just old and tired.
MIKE ELDER (43:33)
Well, I don’t want to talk about session directing the whole time. You were a member of the Groundling Sunday Company.
REECE RIOS (43:39)
Correct.
MIKE ELDER (43:39)
How long from your first Groundlings class until you got on that show? What was the investment, the time investment? Because that’s such a pinnacle.
REECE RIOS (43:47)
Yeah, it’s my, look, I often describe that I love that theater. I love the theater company. I love the people. It’s my favorite Merit badge in this business. It really is. It’s my favorite little Merit badge on my little sash of acting. I’m very proud of it.
But it was a long journey for me, and it was at a time the school hadn’t expanded as much, so the weights were much longer. So I started. I auditioned and then started my basic class with David Hoffman, Limu Emu, Doug.
In March of 2012, I was invited to Sunday Company December of 2019. And then we had a little pandemic and that delayed things for a while. So from the time I wrapped up there, it was a full 10 years from basic to Sunday Company. But again, when I passed through to get into writing lab, the wait was at least a year or two. And then from lab to advanced lab, it was a year or two, if not, but that was a four-year lapse for me. But I think I deferred for a year, so I think it was still like a two or three-year wait.
MIKE ELDER (44:57)
Well, I love that you said it’s your proudest smear badge, because literally my question was going to be, like, we put those sort of things on a pedestal. And I was curious if you saw after you got that, like, a change in auditions or people, opportunities and stuff. Did you find anything? Because we put so much time into those stuff. None of this matters clearly because it matters to you that you got this. But I was just curious if industry wise they really truly valued that more.
REECE RIOS (45:27)
I think it’s recognized by some more than others. There are offices that appreciate that a little more than others and maybe it’s because those offices focus more on comedy and I’m speaking more theatrically. Commercials have been my life’s blood for 25 years. It’s how I’ve sustained my quality of life in this town and throughout this journey. So it’s not like that gave me a ton more access commercially because I’ve had wonderful reps and it’s been a wonderful experience for me overall in the commercial world.
So I’ve had pretty good access there. Theatrically, yeah, there was a little bit of an uptick there. Look, it gave my people, my reps, my management, my theatrical, my theatrical people, some leverage and helped me gain access. I did notice an uptick in comedic opportunities because my theatrical resume is probably 90% crying over dead kids type roles and procedurals and such. It’s far more. There’s a lot more drama on there than comedic. I want to say if there’s like 25 or 30 credits, 25 or 30 credits, I’d say easily 20 plus are dramatic. So then post that, I saw an uptick.
I saw a little bit more of a reach out from certain casting directors, I would say. And then also it opened up the independent world. There were people that just kind of, oh, you did this. That at bare minimum there’s a floor there that you, let’s bring you in for some of these opportunities. Yeah, it’s not like I’m getting direct offers or anything like that, you know. And, you know, I didn’t advance to main company and I think that’s a different world altogether. But for Sunday company, I think it does, you would see some, an uptick in some opportunities and a little bit more of a, you know, a reaction. Oh, you. Oh, there’s.
But I can’t, I don’t think it was this windfall that some people think it is or could be. And maybe, by the way, that’s my experience.
I imagine everyone has a different experience. I know a good friend of mine, one of my closest friends, did not get invited to Sunday company. We went through advance, and, and he’s wildly talented. He he found incredible representation just in the advanced show, and that has served him very, very well, you know? So I think it’s different for everyone.
MIKE ELDER (48:06)
Yeah. Now I wanna, sorry, because I’m an analyzer, why do you think you book more drama? What do you think that’s about? Is it more, are you getting more opportunities just because there’s so many like day players and all these procedurals, or do you think you’re, I don’t, that’s interesting to me.
REECE RIOS (48:24)
Why? Do I think there are more?
MIKE ELDER (48:27)
Do you find it easier to do drama?
REECE RIOS (48:28)
I found it. I don’t know if that’s the right. I love comedy just the same. I love, I have the same, I have the same experience when I’m done pretending to cry as I do when I’m, you know, when I’m delivering a hilarious joke or something. I just really enjoy it all.
Do I find it easier? I’ve been very accessible. And I can, you know, sometimes you can just book a job because you can bring the emotion to the table. And that’s what it’s talking about, being in the room, going back to that. It’s like, I’m going in the room, I’m going to producers for a procedural, and I’m gonna be sitting in front of a panel of strangers, and I’m supposed to have a breakdown. I’ve always been very comfortable with that. I love it.
I think it’s just so fun to melt down and just to be a, I remember, my recurring on Ray Donovan, I booked because it was just one take and it was with, I’m drawing a blank, but I remember I was supposed to have, I was giving this monologue on how I was molested by priests and I was melting down and there’s snot bubbles coming out of my, and I remember the casting associate cut and said, Are you okay? I was like, yeah, I’m great. And they’re like, We don’t need to do it again. You’re good, you’re good. I was like, oh, great.
And I felt great leaving. Well, they asked me to call, come back. I had to go to a call back on at the sound stage, John Papsidera, was the casting director.
Thank you, John. And I was the only one they called back. And the note was, John interfaced with me before I went in the room to read for producers and the director. And the note was, hey, they just want to see where you don’t break down as much. And no one else, they didn’t bring anyone else back. It was just, can you, are you only a messy crier or can you do nothing? I was like, oh, okay, I’ll go in and say the words.
So I did and they gave me the job. And so I was like, so that, I don’t want to say it’s easy. I just worked really hard to have that sort of access and I love it. So I don’t know if that’s, I also don’t know if when people lay eyes on me, they look at me and go, we want you to be funny. I think I’m just a. Being on the other side and directing sessions, it’s funny when you see people come in the room and that please be good or next thing and it’s a comedic role, some people just sell comedy with a look and it’s great. It’s a superpower and I don’t have that. I’m just a regular looking guy with smaller hands.
And I’m six feet tall, 155 pounds. I don’t have this crazy, I don’t have crazy features or anything like that. So I think if I’m up against people that, you know, when there’s someone walks in a room, you can see a client leaning forward like this with a little smile, like, oh, what are you gonna do? I don’t think I elicit that. I don’t get that. I think they’re like, oh, okay, it’s a person. This is a male person. Yeah. With male features.
MIKE ELDER (51:31)
Have you, had you thought about this prior to me asking? Because you, you pointed out how much drama you do. Had you thought about, like, have you ever thought about why?
REECE RIOS (51:38)
Why? I think I, I’ve seen enough casting to where I look at people and I understand why them, not me, in I do. I think I can understand that and I accept it. I wish I had some feature that were interesting in that way. I think I’m a fairly competent improviser and I think I say things like because I’m just not the most confident person. I’ll just say that part. I think I know comedy, but I’m like, well, I did make Sunday Company, so I think that demonstrates a certain thing. But I just, I have to remind myself, myself.
But I I I thought about it because. But I’ve accepted. I’m. I’ve accepted it long ago, too, that I can’t do anything about that. I can’t be that one of those actors that I see many times that it’s just like, oh, you’re an easy sell, especially for this comedic bit that we’re only gonna see you for a moment. And it’s nice when the camera’s on you and we immediately go, what are you gonna do or say? Because you look, you have a.
You have a, you effervescent comedy.
MIKE ELDER (52:38)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (52:39)
You know, and I don’t think I don’t think I offer that. I’m not funny.
MIKE ELDER (52:44)
It’s very good to be aware of.
REECE RIOS (52:46)
Yeah, but yeah, you know, we have to be, right?
MIKE ELDER (52:48)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (52:49)
I’m not hunky enough to be leading man and I’m not so I’m some I’m just this kind of in this sort of oh, I don’t know this in between thing of just a guy. And so my chops have to get the work done. Right. I have to be the best actor for the role. And sometimes my look fits the role, and that’s great and fine.
But, yeah, I think being self-aware you know, when we’re coming up as drama kids in high school or whatever, we’re taught we can be anything. You can be anything.
You can be in. And I think we have to know our limitations and know what we sell. And I make fun of myself all the time, but, like, there’s a reason for that, because I used to have a manager that would consistently send me out for roles. Like, my students have heard this story so many times, like, SWAT team commander. And I’m like, I have a body built for antiquing. Okay, no one’s gonna put a gun in these hands and believe that for a second that I’m in charge of this elite fighting force.
You know what I mean? Like, I know that now you want someone to be a florist? A mailman with a little skip in his step?
MIKE ELDER (53:53)
And inside the bouquet is a gun?
REECE RIOS (53:56)
Yes. Now, I would, I can sell the shit out of that. Florist assassin, I have been a serial killer a couple times, but you can be a weirdo in those roles.
MIKE ELDER (54:04)
Wait, speaking of your drama roles, I’m full disclosure, I’ve never seen Scandal, but I was doing research.
REECE RIOS (54:11)
Oh, you did do research.
MIKE ELDER (54:13)
You’ve had, okay, I have so many questions about this. You had six different titles in 24 episodes.
REECE RIOS (54:19)
Same character, different escalation. Yeah, same character though.
MIKE ELDER (54:22)
In 24 episodes of Scandal, I assumed it was the same character, but it’s funny that they named it different roles.
REECE RIOS (54:27)
Yes.
MIKE ELDER (54:27)
But all that to say, when you got that first one, I think it was in season one, did you know it was going to be recurring?
REECE RIOS (54:33)
No. It was the pilot, yeah.
MIKE ELDER (54:35)
Oh, wow.
REECE RIOS (54:36)
On the pilot, White House press correspondent, whatever. And that was it. And then when they brought me back for a subsequent episode, I’ll never forget that second one, it was like a micro audition within. We had our jobs to do and it was very similar to the job we did. And at that point it was still like whatever the role was very generic. But I’ll never forget we lined up the producer, one of the producers, Tom Verica. I don’t know if Tom will ever see this but boy oh boy am I do I love you Tom and thank you for everything you did.
Tom and that entire Shondaland group of people were just good people. But Tom, you know, kind of had the people that he had in the White House Press Corps lineup. And all he wanted to do because you know it was a Shonda show so I think this was part of it. It’s like there’s a pace to those things. And it was season one, and I think they were just trying to figure out, hey, the thing about White House correspondents is they tend to be the same person. So that can’t be, I don’t think that’s a revolving door of characters. So what they did was line us up and they just drilled us.
They started on the end, and I remember seeing it come down the line. It was like, hey, I just want to hear your line as fast as you can. And people would try and get through it, and if they stumbled again, and I want to stress this, just in it could not have been a warmer approach to the thing. You know, Tom was very patient and kind in doing this because actors were getting really nervous because everybody’s watching. And so it was just like there was one actor in particular who just was almost having a micro panic attack. And Tom was like, it’s okay, it’s okay. Take your time, take a breath and we’ll come back to say the line.
MIKE ELDER (56:18)
This is your scripted line, like each individual script line or the same scripted line for everybody.
REECE RIOS (56:23)
It was our their own scripted line at that time, if I recall. And when he got to me, for whatever reason, I felt fine. I was like, and he goes again. I was like, okay. And I was like, whatever that was. Well, that, I think what that was was, okay, we now have our White House press corps for the, for the series. And then it evolved from there.
Then it was Peter. And then there was an episode where I was sort of identified as Kerry Washington’s inside guy.
She would call me. This was an episode directed by Regina King. What a dream, what a beautiful person. But she directed it and I’ll never forget that. Those days she was like, you’re Kerry’s guy on the inside. She calls you. And so that one particular episode opened up with her calling me on the phone, trying to get her trying to feed me some dish to feed to the whatever.
So it sort of crescendoed from this little under five to a guy that’s, you know, and we, myself and several other of the White House correspondents, we became very close, you know, up until the series wrapped and they brought us to the series wrap party.
MIKE ELDER (57:39)
That’s awesome.
REECE RIOS (57:39)
Yeah, they included us. And so that’s how that, that’s why you see so many titles.
MIKE ELDER (57:44)
But I want to know more specifically, like, So it was one audition, presumably for the pilot.
REECE RIOS (57:49)
Correct.
MIKE ELDER (57:49)
And then that mini audition, and then you never auditioned again. They just called you up, and every time it was like, yes, yes.
REECE RIOS (57:55)
At that point, it was like, Scandal calls you back, Scandal would just send dates.
MIKE ELDER (57:59)
And you had no idea when they were coming?
REECE RIOS (58:01)
No, I started to, once we wrapped our head around what this job was, we were like, wonderful. We scored.
MIKE ELDER (58:10)
Yeah. That’s great.
REECE RIOS (58:11)
You know, Dinora Walcott, she was one with whom I was very close and some others, And we recognize, once we came back a third and fourth time, I was like, logic suggests that this is how this goes.
MIKE ELDER (58:24)
Yeah.
REECE RIOS (58:25)
Unless one of us does something terrible. And then that just persisted for seven seasons.
MIKE ELDER (58:30)
Wait, who was this other person?
REECE RIOS (58:31)
Dinora Walcott.
MIKE ELDER (58:32)
She was in a similar position.
REECE RIOS (58:33)
She was in another. Oh my God, now I’m panicking that I got her last name wrong, and I adore this person with all of my heart. Forgive me as I just make sure, because if she watches this, she needs to know.
MIKE ELDER (58:44)
We got it, right? It’s right.
REECE RIOS (58:46)
I know it is.
MIKE ELDER (58:46)
I trust your Malcolm Gladwell.
REECE RIOS (58:48)
Dinora Walcott.
MIKE ELDER (58:49)
Yeah, that’s what you said.
REECE RIOS (58:49)
I love you so much.
MIKE ELDER (58:51)
Now you second-guessing yourself looks worse.
REECE RIOS (58:53)
Second-guessing, I’m not a confident person. I’m not a confident person. All the cameras.
MIKE ELDER (58:58)
Wait, wait, wait. Feel free to tell me to shut up, but the first one was a co-star.
REECE RIOS (59:01)
Correct.
MIKE ELDER (59:01)
Then it became like a guest star.
REECE RIOS (59:03)
It became, it was pretty much a Wait, wait, wait..
MIKE ELDER (59:04)
And did you end up getting a recurring rate eventually?
REECE RIOS (59:07)
I mean, we got recurring rates, but I was never a reg, never series reg. Never series reg. No, they gave us abover scale.
MIKE ELDER (59:13)
So you kept getting a bump every time?
REECE RIOS (59:14)
Yeah, they paid us above scale once we got established, and they were, that’s that I mean they were you know there’s so many productions that that that are tight knit families after that that one especially was just Tony Goldwyn and Kerry Washington and Sean everyone from top down was were so inclusive almost to the point where I was like uncomfortable and yeah just really made you feel like part of it even if we weren’t regs and I remember I remember Kerry was sitting next to me one time getting makeup done and it was, this was like December of 2012 and I only remember that because I think it was on the heels of Django Unchained where she, correct me if I’m wrong, I think she was nominated for an Academy Award, I think. So she’s Kerry Washington and her stars, she’s a shooting star at this point. She’s wonderful and so lovely. And I’m just me, you know, very, very unassuming, unconfident me.
MIKE ELDER (1:00:22)
Small hands.
REECE RIOS (1:00:24)
Smaller hands. They’re perfectly fine. You can do a lot with these hands. I did this to myself. But I was sitting next to her in the makeup chair and I had a Trident commercial running. Oh, no. I got that wrong. No,. It doesn’t matter what it was. It was a commercial. Okay. And it wasn’t even.
I wasn’t even the spokes in the commercial. I was like someone who just had a small little moment. And I was sitting in the chair next to her, and she was getting stuff done. So she kind of reached out and tapped me on the shoulder. Reece. Reece. And I was like, yes.
And she goes, I just. I saw your Trident commercial last night, and I got so excited.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:07)
That’s awesome.
REECE RIOS (1:01:08)
Right? I was like, I remember just thinking, oh, I saw Django Unchained and I saw you and I felt the same for you. It was like no different.
But it was that.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:19)
Did you say that?
REECE RIOS (1:01:20)
Yes. That’s great. That was my real lame attempt at like whatever trying to.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:25)
That’s yes and-ing.
REECE RIOS (1:01:26)
Yeah. I was like, oh yeah, and I saw your little movie that for which you were nominated. I was like, Good job! But she was so sincere She was absolutely, and that’s how that was. That’s how that experience was. Tony and Tom Verica, they were just so warm.
So that was a very precious thing that I got to do.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:52)
That’s cool. Wait, sorry, back to money. One more thing on that.
REECE RIOS (1:01:54)
Yeah, talk about it.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:55)
You said they paid you above scale?
REECE RIOS (1:01:58)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (1:01:59)
They didn’t have to do that, right?
REECE RIOS (1:02:00)
No, no.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:00)
That’s great.
REECE RIOS (1:02:01)
No.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:02)
And at what point did that happen?
REECE RIOS (1:02:03)
Probably by season 3 or 4. Yes, maybe somewhere in there. And then my agents were like, hey, you know, they love you and they’re just, you know, we’re asking for above scale. And to which I was, look, I’m always like, whatever, I’ll work for below scale. I’m stupid, I’m not good. Don’t ask me to rep you. Don’t take my business class.
Because I’ll just give you stuff.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:23)
Well, no, I was gonna ask, that was gonna be my question. Did they pay you scale that entire time?
REECE RIOS (1:02:27)
No, no, they paid above scale. After a certain point, they were paying us above scale and we weren’t even asking for it.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:33)
Are you getting decent residuals from that?
REECE RIOS (1:02:35)
Yeah.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:35)
That’s awesome.
REECE RIOS (1:02:36)
Yeah, still do.
MIKE ELDER (1:02:36)
Cause I just think of like Matt Jones, who I’ve had on the podcast multiple times, and he said, I made no money on Breaking Bad. It was nothing. And he had to be in something similar, like 15-20 episodes. And so I’m just curious how, ’cause they’re not required to do much for you.
REECE RIOS (1:02:53)
No. Now that might be the difference of ABC money and FX money. Right. I think that’s where the difference lies is this is primetime ABC. At a time where still. Yeah, it’s still, we’re still doing that more than we’re streaming, I think, at least shows. So I think, you know, they had much deeper pockets for that sort of thing. But yeah, no, there was it, you know, there’s, I get some nice collection.
In fact, I get two sets because I incorporated somewhere in there. So half of it comes to all the shows I did post incorporation, et cetera. But no, it’s good. It’s a nice little chunk. It’s nothing that it’s not enough to get me insurance, but it’s enough to get me on my way.
MIKE ELDER (1:03:36)
Yeah, that’s great. All right, we gotta get out of here, but I asked one last question. Who took a chance on you?
REECE RIOS (1:03:42)
So many people.
MIKE ELDER (1:03:44)
Well, name them all then.
REECE RIOS (1:03:45)
My wife.
MIKE ELDER (1:03:49)
She cast you in that Trident commercial. A lot of people don’t know that.
REECE RIOS (1:03:52)
You mean industry-wise?
MIKE ELDER (1:03:52)
No, it’s fine. You can say your wife all you want. That’s fine.
REECE RIOS (1:03:55)
Who took a chance on me?
MIKE ELDER (1:03:56)
I just think it’s important for people to take a chance on people. I know Tom Verica or whatever he is.
REECE RIOS (1:04:03)
Tom Verica, yeah, he took, I’m trying to think of a way, because it’s a fair question. I’m also like, well, isn’t someone taking a chance? I suppose we tether it to a time where we’re relative unknown to that person. You know, because I.
MIKE ELDER (1:04:20)
Choose your own adventure. I just think to get anywhere out here, somebody has to take a chance on you. Whether that’s your first agent, whether that’s a casting director that brings you in a lot of times and keeps trying.
REECE RIOS (1:04:27)
Yeah, well then I think.
MIKE ELDER (1:04:29)
A producer that gives you a recurring role, you know, it’s all that.
REECE RIOS (1:04:31)
You know, when I moved back out here, I was born here, raised in Texas, started this career out of Texas, moved back out here. I will say then if I tie it back, because, and I talk about this with my students all the time, they’re always like, how do we pitch ourselves if we have nothing on our resume? And I’m like, well, we all have nothing at some point. We all have a blank resume at some point. And you’re right, someone has to take a chance on you. And so we lean heavily on our reps to get some opportunities our way, et cetera, et cetera. And I’m trying, you know, I will tell you that like, oh, Scott David took a chance on me, you know, because when I first moved back, now I’m, I moved back here almost 20 years ago, but now I’m with guys in my category who have been here because I spent five years in Dallas, based out of Dallas in this career.
So these guys had a head start. I’m coming out of Dallas with one theatrical credit at the time because it was because they shot this shot at Dallas Prison Break, right? So when I came out here, I was like, I got to play catch up a little bit. And this was at a time where workshops were a little more prevalent and one of the few things you could do proactively to get and showcase. And I remember I showcased for Scott David, a Friday at one place and Saturday morning at the very next place. And at the first time I remember thinking, I was like, oh my God, I’m gonna look like an insane person obsessed. And I said as much to him that Saturday morning.
I said, Scott, I feel silly. You saw me last night. Now I’m second guessing this. He was like, why? Let’s play. Well, cut to, he gives me an opportunity the very next week for a guest on Criminal Minds.
MIKE ELDER (1:06:14)
Amazing.
REECE RIOS (1:06:15)
I didn’t get that. And then he brought me in the very next week for another role, and this was for an unsub, the serial killer of that episode. And I got that. And I was like, yeah, I suppose Scott David. And that really did help create a bit of an on-ramp.
MIKE ELDER (1:06:30)
That’s cool. Is he still casting? No, I haven’t heard that name.
REECE RIOS (1:06:32)
Yeah, I think the big fallout with all the casting work that went down to. Yeah, the very thing that helped me get a foothold took him and many others down. But Scott was there’s a reason you can look on resumes and almost everyone has Criminal Minds. And I, you know, say what you will, but he really gave people an open door where it was so hard to gain access and, and would continue to try to find people out there that were just desperate for any opportunity. And so that yielded, actually, that went to Linda Lowey. That became Scandal and so on and so forth. And from there, it kind of, yeah, from there.
It just became fairly regular. Yeah, so though I, yeah, Scott David gave a lot of people opportunities. So shout out to Scott David. I know things went funky in that world and it’s too bad, but, I, yeah.
MIKE ELDER (1:07:26)
This makes me think you should reach out to the casting director of the Call of Duty movie and just figure out where they get coffee and then bump into them two days in a row and say, this is weird.
REECE RIOS (1:07:34)
But see now this brings us full circle to the whole thing, but Call of Duty is guys running around looking cool and tough, guy uniforms holding guns.
MIKE ELDER (1:07:40)
Yeah, but you were in Prison Break. What’d you play in Prison Break?
REECE RIOS (1:07:43)
Do you really want to know my role?
MIKE ELDER (1:07:45)
Janitor?
REECE RIOS (1:07:45)
Botanical Garden volunteer. Fucking gardener. And I had my sceene with Wentworth Miller.
MIKE ELDER (1:07:50)
With a gun in the hose.
REECE RIOS (1:07:52)
No, but I did carry a hose. God damn, I carried a hose.
MIKE ELDER (1:07:56)
Reece, this was delightful. Thank you so much for doing the podcast.
REECE RIOS (1:07:59)
I enjoyed it. Thank you. I hope it was worth your time.
MIKE ELDER (1:08:02)
It was great. This was lovely. I wish you well. You got a tail slate here.
REECE RIOS (1:08:05)
I’m Reece Rios.
MIKE ELDER (1:08:07)
That was great.
REECE RIOS (1:08:08)
Yeah, man.
🎵 ROCKFORD (59:30) 🎵
MTV and the channel E!. A thing for a celebrity.
